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Minor stole parents card, used contactless. Are we liable?

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by theroo, Jul 30, 2020 at 5:34 AM.

  1. theroo

    theroo UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    14 4
    Hi there. Recently a child came in (10 years old) and used their parents credit card for a contactless payment. In recent years, we have noticed that more and more children have their own contactless cards so we did not question the transaction. In this case, the child came in twice and the second time the staff noticed that the card looked like an adult's credit card so we asked the child if their parents knew they were using the card. The child said yes.

    A few days later, the parents came to us saying that the card had been stolen by their child and that we were wrong to take payment in the first place and are demanding a refund for what the child spent in the shop.

    What are our rights and what are we obligated to do?

    This also really got me interested in contactless payments as well. Are we as a trade legally obligated to check that the name on the card matches the individual? These days, who actually checks?? People sometimes even have their card in a wallet and tap the card so we never see the card! So who is responsible?

    Thank you!
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 5:34 AM By: theroo Member since: Apr 10, 2018
    #1
  2. intheTRADE

    intheTRADE UKBF Regular Free Member

    316 103
    How much are we talking? I would just refund the parents and move on. Maybe look at procedures for minors using cards to pay for things. Especially children around that age

    My daughter is 10 in August and I wouldn't even contemplate giving her any kind of card just yet and I would expect any shopkeeper to check a card of a minor before letting them use it
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 8:16 AM By: intheTRADE Member since: Apr 14, 2019
    #2
  3. Bob Morgan

    Bob Morgan UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    841 231
    NEVER WORK WITH ANIMALS AND CHILDREN! - Apparently attributed to W C Fields
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 8:16 AM By: Bob Morgan Member since: Apr 15, 2018
    #3
  4. Annoying Donkey

    Annoying Donkey UKBF Ace Free Member

    2,864 987
    I don't know what the law says, however...

    You might tell them, that you'll first have to inform the police that a stolen credit card has been used in your shop.... ;)

    Wonder what ever happened to parental responsibility...?

    If you want to be nice and the parent returns the goods, then maybe give a goodwill refund...
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 8:18 AM By: Annoying Donkey Member since: Sep 13, 2009
    #4
  5. fisicx

    fisicx It's Major Clanger! Staff Member

    32,910 9,760
    If there was fraud the banks will reimburse not you. That's the whole point of contactless payments - the shop is not responsible.

    However, the parents are as much to blame as anyone.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 8:49 AM By: fisicx Member since: Sep 12, 2006
    #5
  6. Darren_Ssc

    Darren_Ssc UKBF Ace Free Member

    1,088 311
    I think this is correct, the parents could claim a refund from the bank. Let them have the joy of dealing with it. I dare say there is an element of 'trying it on' with such cases.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:05 AM By: Darren_Ssc Member since: Mar 1, 2019
    #6
  7. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

    23,486 2,835
    Parents had the card lying around to be used....
    Not secured from being taken.

    If I had done that my parents would have required me to pay the money back to them. In cash or by working.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:12 AM By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #7
  8. Annoying Donkey

    Annoying Donkey UKBF Ace Free Member

    2,864 987
    My parents would've gotten the belt out... then made me work it out...
    I was bought up in non-PC times...
    Debatable whether it made a man out of me... :D
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:15 AM By: Annoying Donkey Member since: Sep 13, 2009
    #8
  9. Bob Morgan

    Bob Morgan UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    841 231
    You really took a Payment Card from a 10 year old?
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:21 AM By: Bob Morgan Member since: Apr 15, 2018
    #9
  10. MikeJ

    MikeJ UKBF Big Shot Free Member

    5,808 1,699
    Can you imagine if a child had stolen cash and taken it to a shop, and the parents complained to the shop for accepting money from a child?
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:21 AM By: MikeJ Member since: Jan 15, 2008
    #10
  11. MikeJ

    MikeJ UKBF Big Shot Free Member

    5,808 1,699
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:23 AM By: MikeJ Member since: Jan 15, 2008
    #11
  12. Bob Morgan

    Bob Morgan UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    841 231
    WTF does 'Gotten' mean?
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:23 AM By: Bob Morgan Member since: Apr 15, 2018
    #12
  13. The Byre

    The Byre UKBF Legend Full Member

    10,059 4,114
    The owner of the card or the issuer of the card.

    If the card was stolen, it is the responsibility of the card holder (the person whose name appears on the card) to notify the bank or the CC issuer and it should be immediately blocked.

    If it is not immediately blocked or if any other circumstance caused by the issuer prevents the blocking of the card, the issuer of the CC becomes responsible for any losses.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:41 AM By: The Byre Member since: Aug 13, 2013
    #13
  14. gpietersz

    gpietersz UKBF Ace Full Member

    1,256 291
    A lot of shops have not been accepting cash recently, so if you want kids to learn how to handle money you may not have much choice.

    If we cash is abolished much younger children will need cards (i.e. old enough to get pocket money).
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:45 AM By: gpietersz Member since: Sep 10, 2019
    #14
  15. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

    23,486 2,835
    I would have been hurt too - but that was normal kind of punishment anyway.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 9:53 AM By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #15
  16. Annoying Donkey

    Annoying Donkey UKBF Ace Free Member

    2,864 987
    Past Participle of "Get".

    Fancy me teaching English... :D
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 10:13 AM By: Annoying Donkey Member since: Sep 13, 2009
    #16
  17. MikeJ

    MikeJ UKBF Big Shot Free Member

    5,808 1,699
    Usually followed by "Himmel" in WW2 comic books. :D
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 10:18 AM By: MikeJ Member since: Jan 15, 2008
    #17
  18. Paul Norman

    Paul Norman UKBF Ace Free Member

    2,708 831
    A roughly equivalent thing happens online. Children buy stuff using their parents laptops, and pay using their parents paypal accounts - because all the passwords are saved on the laptop.

    In a physical shop I would be wary of taking a credit card from a 10 year old. But I am old and out of touch - I suspect that is going to happen a lot (see debates about cashless society).

    I think that if the card, or payment, is taken in good faith then the responsibility lies elsewhere than with the retailer.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 10:25 AM By: Paul Norman Member since: Apr 8, 2010
    #18
  19. intheTRADE

    intheTRADE UKBF Regular Free Member

    316 103
    In the future yes, but not now.

    Anyway, she is 9. There won't ever be a time where she is out on the streets on her own going into shops buying things for a few years yet.

    Whilst a lot of comments on this thread are correct in terms of the legal responsibility of the named cardholder, I think there is a moral responsibility of the OP's shop in general. Accepting card payments from a 10 year old is asking for trouble. Still accepting a card that doesn't belong to the 10 year old after asking them is just plain stupidity. The value of the purchase if contactless can't be anymore than £45 so I would just refund the parents and move on with new procedures. Not worth the hassle to argue it
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 10:26 AM By: intheTRADE Member since: Apr 14, 2019
    #19
  20. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

    23,486 2,835
    And yet shops sell to 9 year olds. Heck, I was buying sweets in the corner shop aged 3 and using my own money.
     
    Posted: Jul 30, 2020 at 10:38 AM By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #20