How to get out of personal guarentee for business with crook director

Discussion in 'Insolvency' started by Izzy daw, Feb 24, 2018.

  1. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

    10,599 1,110

    But does it exist outside your solicitor?
    What is it otherwise known as to other people? Or the courts?
     
    Posted: Feb 25, 2018 By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #21
  2. Simon Green

    Simon Green UKBF Regular Free Member

    109 9
    Hi,
    To be completely honest my wife and me spent a lot of hours talking to our solicitor at the time about what she referred to as a Wipping Order but nothing came of it; Ive also been surprised not to get any result myself on google - this Wipping Order was an idea whereby the debt would be shared.
    In our case we lost the lot, and I mean the whole lot including family home and personal bankrupcy got us away from the nightmare.
    Trust me chum, throwing good after bad money in an attempt to get the debt shared is worse than fantasy; its a dark nightmare which brings a lot of persistent problems.
     
    Posted: Feb 25, 2018 By: Simon Green Member since: Dec 4, 2017
    #22
  3. Scalloway

    Scalloway UKBF Legend Free Member

    14,046 2,993
    Posted: Feb 25, 2018 By: Scalloway Member since: Jun 6, 2010
    #23
  4. Simon Green

    Simon Green UKBF Regular Free Member

    109 9
    Whatever the terminology which Ive obviously got wrong:
    As ever I’m here to try to be non-judgmental as well as helpful to others based on my experience and sharing knowledge and understanding for the good of others hopefully.
    Which is why (Wipping Order or no Wipping Order) I would strongly advise not to throw good money after bad, even if personal bankrupcy becomes the end game which then releases the individual from the appauling predicament described on this forum and which is clearly a result of someone else’s unethical decisions and behaviour.
     
    Posted: Feb 25, 2018 By: Simon Green Member since: Dec 4, 2017
    #24
  5. Mark T Jones

    Mark T Jones UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

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    I don’t th8nk you’re being challenged. Personally I’d be interested to know what this is all about.
     
    Posted: Feb 25, 2018 By: Mark T Jones Member since: Nov 4, 2015
    #25
  6. Izzy daw

    Izzy daw UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    6 0
    Thanks everyone !
    Does anyone know of any good reasonable lawyer?
     
    Posted: Feb 26, 2018 By: Izzy daw Member since: Feb 24, 2018
    #26
  7. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

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    The two terms don't go together.
    Sorry, only lawyers I know that are good are ball busters. Divorce lawyers.

    Saying that, Dominic Kay I hear is a firecracker.
    Used to be northeast area?
     
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2018
    Posted: Feb 26, 2018 By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #27
  8. Lisa Thomas

    Lisa Thomas UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

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    If you DM me I can recommend someone.
     
    Posted: Feb 27, 2018 By: Lisa Thomas Member since: Apr 20, 2015
    #28
  9. Izzy daw

    Izzy daw UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    6 0
    Hi all, Alot has developed since my last post. To summarise, the Crooked director is planning on making the company insolvent, as it is lease hold and all the build work/loan spent on the property, it will terminate the lease making the value of the practice 0. He then is going to make a deal with the landlord to make a new lease, to take over the practice for next to nothing as he knows him.

    By doing this he will write off all the company debt he made, and make all the other shareholders pay for the loans via the personal guarentees while he walks away with the practice. We have been contacted by the other (foolish) shareholders that took his side, one of which stated that the crooked director is planning on doing the above mentioned, he has evidence, the crooked director has planned this from the start and had advice via a solicitor and protected all his assetts for when this happens.

    He and this other director formed a phoenix company registered to the same address of the practice online for when the company goes insolvent. When i mentioned wrongful trading he hastly stated that the company has stopped trading to prevent investigation by company house.

    It seems we have all the potential evidence, but i dont know where to go with it. I am going to report him to the GDC and CQC but whether they will do anything is another matter.

    I have seeked legal advice prior to having evidence of the fraud and seeking further legal advice about the fraud, but will take time and he will try to do the insolvency via defaulting loan payments very shortly.
    any help would be much appreciated
     
    Posted: Mar 26, 2018 By: Izzy daw Member since: Feb 24, 2018
    #29
  10. Mr D

    Mr D UKBF Legend Free Member

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    So get his conduct as a director investigated. Wind the company up.
     
    Posted: Mar 26, 2018 By: Mr D Member since: Feb 12, 2017
    #30
  11. Simon Green

    Simon Green UKBF Regular Free Member

    109 9
    As before:
    Never Ever throw good money after bad!!!
    Personal Bankrupcy is clearly what’s best;
    Please stop throwing good money after bad!
     
    Posted: Mar 26, 2018 By: Simon Green Member since: Dec 4, 2017
    #31
  12. Lisa Thomas

    Lisa Thomas UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    2,457 297
    If he is going to place the Company into a formal insolvency procedure, such as Liquidation, the Liquidator will investigate his conduct and has the power to pursue the Directors for any misconduct under the Insolvency Act 1986, which amongst other things includes wrongful trading.

    Alternatively you could place the Company into Compulsory Liquidation through the Court but it will cost you more money that you may not get back.

    I'm not sure what you mean about Companies House doing an investigation?
     
    Posted: Mar 27, 2018 By: Lisa Thomas Member since: Apr 20, 2015
    #32
  13. Simon Green

    Simon Green UKBF Regular Free Member

    109 9
    I still feel personal bankruptcy is your best route out otherwise things can/will become a living hell as good money is thrown after bad.
    You loose the lot but that includes debts you are facing through failures of business;
    Trust me chum.
     
    Posted: Mar 30, 2018 By: Simon Green Member since: Dec 4, 2017
    #33
  14. Izzy daw

    Izzy daw UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    6 0
    Hi all thanks for all the advice. I followed up alot of it and did what I could.

    We managed to sell the dental practice despite the crooks attempts to stop us in which he assaulted the new owner and stole equipment and DVR box with evidence of the assault on the CCTV.

    1- went to police - they didn't care said it was a civil matter

    2- looked into personal bankruptcy and that wasn't an option as I would lose my house.

    Using the money from the sale they paid off the majority of company debts and paid of some of the loans e remaining directors didn't want to do insolvency as it would cost 10k to do and the IP would want the directors to cover their fee if there wasn't enough stuff to cover their fee which there wasnt as it was mostly hire purcahase.

    We have got a final settlement for the remaining loans a good 400k in total split between a few loans. Which 4/6 personal guarentors said they would pay their share lump sum, one trying to do monthly payments. As expected the crook director dissolved his company and has sent the loan company a ''drawn up list of assets, income and expense made by his accountant and seeking debt advice" suggesting he's planning on declaring bankruptcy and being in a good position to do so as was premeditated.

    We tried to get loan companies to split the PG to 1/6th each. 1 agreed, and did so and have been paid. 1 loan company agreed to take non payers to court first before chasing non payers. and remaining two said if they dont recieve payment in full they will refer whole thing to the legal recoveries department and go for ccjs etc.

    I am not sure if paying our 4/6ths would be the best option knowing that 2/6th won't pay lumpsum -one out right and other asking for monthlys, but perhaps it will limit the amount of interest and fees added on as it's a lower outstanding sum.

    The other 3/4 are planning on suing the the crook director whos planning on declaring bankruptcy/ not paying. Seems like more spending bad on bad to me.

    Not sure if there anyone else I can report the crook to or anything else I can do to get out of this mess. Any advice would be appreciated
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2018
    Posted: Oct 4, 2018 By: Izzy daw Member since: Feb 24, 2018
    #34