Anyone had a privately issued camera parking ticket?

Discussion in 'General Business Forum' started by fathippy, Apr 6, 2011.

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  1. Tommo

    Tommo UKBF Newcomer Free Member

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    If you think it's a business like stance to do what some geeza in a puffer jacket tells you and give him £100 quid then I'm on the wrong forum.

    Knowledge and Savvy
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2011
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Tommo Member since: Jul 15, 2009
  2. LicensedToTrade

    LicensedToTrade UKBF Legend Free Member

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    There is a big difference in ethical and unethical business. Pushing the boundaries of supply and demand is one thing (charging £6 for a can of coke from the mini-bar for example) but bullying people into paying 'parking fines' that are not enforceable by any known UK law is an entirely different matter.

    I haven't seen anyone take an 'anti-business' stance yet, all I have seen is members, including myself, taking a 'pro-ethics in business' stance.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: LicensedToTrade Member since: Nov 7, 2009
  3. daniel.benson

    daniel.benson UKBF Enthusiast Full Member - Verified Business

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    They are not fines they are invoices and they come under contractual law. They may be scammers, rips off or whatever else you call it but they are neither acting outside the law and when the new freedom bill comes into force this year these parking companies will be able to hold vehicle keepers responsible for these charges.

    We don't like clamping or ticketing because we don't like to pay for it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2011
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: daniel.benson Member since: Nov 16, 2010
  4. Tommo

    Tommo UKBF Newcomer Free Member

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    (private) Clamping is being outlawed though :)
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2011
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Tommo Member since: Jul 15, 2009
  5. daniel.benson

    daniel.benson UKBF Enthusiast Full Member - Verified Business

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    Yes maybe but now all the landowners groups, property groups and car parking companies have joined together and are saying they will fight the ban and take it through every court in the land and with the push over courts we have dont hold your breath as it may be years before it gets band, and all they are doing is swaping one form of enforcement for another :eek:
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2011
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: daniel.benson Member since: Nov 16, 2010
  6. Consistency

    Consistency Banned

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    I think there are instances where these companies do a sterling job. Especially in residential areas and not just in businesses. There are a lot of private housing establishments that the council have no authority over and inconsiderate residents park in each others bays etc leaving the tenants with nowhere to park.

    It is these who say the tickets are not enforceable etc and determine to take no notice and flout the terms and conditions of parking that the landowner wants, that makes me think clamping is worthwhile. It deals with the matter much quicker.

    I myself have had tickets in the past and it was my own fault. I was glad not to have been clamped as the signs said that I could have been. It is folk who say I am not paying etc, that make companies clamp even more.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Consistency Member since: May 21, 2010
  7. LicensedToTrade

    LicensedToTrade UKBF Legend Free Member

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    They aren't swapping anything. They are outlawing clamping and towing on private land in England and Wales (already illegal in Scotland) and allowing these companies to continue fining people, they aren't introducing any new measures.

    So the same rules that applied to these fines in the current protection of freedoms bills will apply in the new one comes November. That being said, this 'contract law' you speak of is as weak as a teabag in the atlantic ocean.

    Most payouts on these fines happen when the 'offender' pays up on receipt of a few letters as it all looks very official and worrying. How many people do you know who have been successfully taken to court for an unpaid private parking fine?
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: LicensedToTrade Member since: Nov 7, 2009
  8. daniel.benson

    daniel.benson UKBF Enthusiast Full Member - Verified Business

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    I think you need to read the freedom bill a little closer as Keeper liability is including in it. The only weakness in the current system is to say I was't the driver at the time which makes the ticket unenforceable as the keeper does not have to provide driver details. When this changes the biggest loophole in the book will be closed.

    It all comes down to signage and fees charged which alot of people dispute.
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2011
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: daniel.benson Member since: Nov 16, 2010
  9. Consistency

    Consistency Banned

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    I think it is the dishonest ones, who ruin it for the rest of us. If people parked considerably and considerate to others then landowners would not require the services of these companies.

    Near where I live, there is a row alongside a road and about 8 cars can fit in all one behind the other. However some just stroll in and roll up without a care, leaving room for only four cars and the other cars have to go and pay and display. It is horrendous. Near that area, there is parking enforcement and there was all this talk of tickets not being worth the paper they are written on and so the landowner just wanted straight clamping.

    When clamping is banned, this could result in a bit of vigilanteism. I hope not but if drivers parked better then there would be no need for any of this.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Consistency Member since: May 21, 2010
  10. JohnnyCash

    JohnnyCash Guest

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    Whats dishonest about it?

    The company pays for parking spaces. They tell you how long you can park for free, and if you stay longer you will need to pay £x. You ignore the time limits, and get a bill for £x. It all seems pretty straight forward and above board to me?

    Unless they are hiding the signs behind a bush or putting them in deliberately obscure places, I don't see how you can call it dishonest.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: JohnnyCash Member since: Dec 8, 2010
  11. Atilla

    Atilla UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Because the car park owners often don't have a scooby about 1. The Law and 2. The draconian restrictions that are suddenly put in place once the scammers get involved.

    Check out Excel and Bradford Foster Square if wish to see how this works.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Atilla Member since: Aug 25, 2008
  12. LicensedToTrade

    LicensedToTrade UKBF Legend Free Member

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    I've looked through the bill and the relevant ammendments ( http://www.publications.parliament....-2011/0146/cbill_2010-20110146_en_20.htm#sch4 )


    ...yes it does now state that if the details of the driver are unknown to the company they can pursue the keeper of the vehicle. Provided of course that they are registered to do so. But unfortunately for these companies they still don't have a leg to stand on, now they just have the right to pester the keeper. They have knocked one leg off a hundred legged spider.

    All in all the incoming protection of freedoms bill only serves to hinder clampers, it hasn't improved the position of companies issuing parking notices at all.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: LicensedToTrade Member since: Nov 7, 2009
  13. Atilla

    Atilla UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Have you actually looked into these issues to any depth?

    Even the press don't do basic research. They still refer to the 'tickets' as fines.
    Mind, they are in good company, even Asda do. They have the scammers in just to give a semblance of order to their car parks - note. Some are council carparks and outside the control of Asda. Get a ticket, tell the Branch Manager, ticket gone.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Atilla Member since: Aug 25, 2008
  14. Atilla

    Atilla UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Not strictly true.
    Most of the letters they send out do show the companies breaking the Law.
    Fraud, harassment etc.
    Any letter sent out addressed to
    Owner/keeper/hirer/driver is illegal. Therefore these companies are acting illegally.

    And i wouldn't hold your breath on thinking the change in Law will give them powers to hold a vehicle quite so easily.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Atilla Member since: Aug 25, 2008
  15. Atilla

    Atilla UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Fines???
    You mean invoices.
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Atilla Member since: Aug 25, 2008
  16. Consistency

    Consistency Banned

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    It is the ones who are looking for every loophole to get out of paying any of these tickets who are the real scammers. They park on free car parks, next to pay and display and use a loophole to continue getting it for free.

    There may be some bad clampers out there and these are the ones we hear of, what about the good they do? If it was someone parked on YOUR front lawn, what would YOU do? Do you think you have the LEGAL authority to just pay a bloke £20 to get rid of it? What would YOU do? It is not much different.

    Why should landowners have to go to such expenses of putting up bollards that they then have to be responsible for? Why not just be able to leave their car parks and allow good users to come and go and only deal with the ones who have broken the terms and conditions as laid out?

    Should not respectful drivers be able to come and go in comfort and convenience, after all they are not the ones who are taking the michael? Why should the rest of the good drivers be put to great inconvenience to counteract the free parking scammers?
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Consistency Member since: May 21, 2010
  17. Atilla

    Atilla UKBF Ace Free Member

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    Someone parks on my front lawn?
    Banging a clamp on it isn't going to achieve anything now is it?
    Regarding the T&Cs. Remember, these usually have sod all to do with the Landowner.
    Draconian 'rules' and fictitious charges invented by the scammers. They are only allowed to recover their losses, not invent charges. What's the loss on overstaying 20 mins in a free car park?
     
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2011
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Atilla Member since: Aug 25, 2008
  18. daniel.benson

    daniel.benson UKBF Enthusiast Full Member - Verified Business

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    At least they wont park there again?
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: daniel.benson Member since: Nov 16, 2010
  19. Atilla

    Atilla UKBF Ace Free Member

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    No, cos i'll have the local pikey's round and have it scrapped. :D
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: Atilla Member since: Aug 25, 2008
  20. LicensedToTrade

    LicensedToTrade UKBF Legend Free Member

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    Actually I don't mean fines, but I don't mean invoices either, what I should have said was 'charges' as they are defined in the bill. :D
     
    Posted: Apr 26, 2011 By: LicensedToTrade Member since: Nov 7, 2009
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