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Invoice dispute

Discussion in 'Legal' started by fattony, Aug 2, 2012.

  1. fattony

    fattony UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    Posts: 624 Likes: 25
    Hi

    We contracted a company in to move a portacabin, it was remaining on the same site just in a different location.

    The company we got in didn't survey the job, I gave them size of portacabin and described the job it needed to lift over a 4m tree so it wasn't straight forward, because of this they wouldn't give a price, they would just charge an hourly rate £65 per hour plus travel to and from they're yard, this was agreed it would be an hourly rate.

    The guy turned up to move it but the lorry was to small to lift over the tree, I believe the problem was the reach of the crane rather than height restrictions or weight limit, so off he went to get a bigger lorry.

    He returned with a bigger lorry and was finished by 11.30am started at 8am, when the cabin was moved they didn't even level it, I thought this would be normal practice, surely you don't move a portacabin and leave un levelled?

    Anyway I received the bill which was for 6 hours, I presume I'm being charged the time to switch lorries, it's a max 30 mile drive each way for them, so if I said 2 hours travel and 2 hours to move it that would be reasonable in my eyes, I didn't give them the distance the crane would need to reach out other than it needs to clear a 4m tree, and to be fair they didn't ask.

    Do I have to pay the 6 hours or can I contest it, where do I go bearing in mind I now have to level it!
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2012
    Posted: Aug 2, 2012 By: fattony Member since: Jul 16, 2009
    #1
  2. OldWelshGuy

    OldWelshGuy UKBF Legend Staff Member

    Posts: 20,420 Likes: 7,049
    if you made the job clear and they brought the wrong vehicle then I would dispute on that basis.
     
    Posted: Aug 2, 2012 By: OldWelshGuy Member since: Jun 12, 2008
    #2
  3. Paul_Rosser

    Paul_Rosser UKBF Big Shot Full Member - Verified Business

    Posts: 4,543 Likes: 1,106
    Refuse to pay it and offer to pay what you consider a fair price for the service you received.
     
    Posted: Aug 2, 2012 By: Paul_Rosser Member since: Jul 5, 2012
    #3
  4. fattony

    fattony UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    Posts: 624 Likes: 25
    Thanks, where do you stand legally by refusing to pay and just pay what I think is fair? There wasn't a contract just a verbal hourly rate agreed
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2012
    Posted: Aug 2, 2012 By: fattony Member since: Jul 16, 2009
    #4
  5. Paul_Rosser

    Paul_Rosser UKBF Big Shot Full Member - Verified Business

    Posts: 4,543 Likes: 1,106
    Posted: Aug 2, 2012 By: Paul_Rosser Member since: Jul 5, 2012
    #5
  6. Cylon

    Cylon UKBF Newcomer Free Member

    Posts: 414 Likes: 136
    You wouldn't have to pay for hours spent changing lorries as you agreed an hourly rate for the job, bringing the wrong lorry is a mistake made by the company providing the service.

    Depending on the site the portacabin was located wouldn't a risk assesment needed to be completed and at the very least the company should have provided a hiab lorry capable of doing the job you had requested. If it was a local company there's really no excuse for them not sending someone (preferably the driver/crane operator) to survey what was required.

    If needed you could also use the drivers tachograph records to back you up on the timescale.

    Although leveling of the portacabin can be obtained by use of a car jack it would have been good practice for the driver to have leveled it for you as the portacabin can twist and warp over time if not level making the doors difficult to open.
     
    Posted: Aug 3, 2012 By: Cylon Member since: Jul 5, 2012
    #6
  7. internetspaceships

    internetspaceships Banned Full Member

    Posts: 6,982 Likes: 2,328
    Seriously Tony you did this all verbally? Having seen all the problems and threads on this forum whilst you've been a member about exactly this kind of situation?

    Your problem fella.
     
    Posted: Aug 3, 2012 By: internetspaceships Member since: Sep 7, 2009
    #7
  8. The Resolver

    The Resolver UKBF Ace Full Member

    Posts: 2,827 Likes: 917

    A slip I'm sure but, for the record, the SoGA does not apply to services. Paul's link is correct - ie to the Supply of Goods and Services Act.

    Just write and explain that, having visited the site , it was their responsibility to bring the correct lorry. It was also not using reasonable care and skill to place down the cabin without levelling it first.

    Deduct from their invoice (£X) the charge for the time assessed for sending in the wrong lorry (£Y) and obtain a quote from someone else for levelling (£Z) and offer to pay £X-Y-Z, heading the letter 'without prejudice save as to costs' explaining the calculation.

    Then forget about it. If they agree - pay it. If not- wait for them to issue in the Small Claims Court and when you win , show the judge your letter and ask that they pay your costs and expenses as a litigant in person for wasting your time and the court's time.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: The Resolver Member since: Mar 31, 2006
    #8
  9. MikeJ

    MikeJ UKBF Big Shot Free Member

    Posts: 5,087 Likes: 1,453
    They didn't visit the site though, until they tried to start work. OP had mentioned the lift, but not the reach.

    Was this a specialist portakabin guy, or just a guy with a crane? If a specialist, I'd expect levelling. If not, then I'd not expect it levelled.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: MikeJ Member since: Jan 15, 2008
    #9
  10. Paul_Rosser

    Paul_Rosser UKBF Big Shot Full Member - Verified Business

    Posts: 4,543 Likes: 1,106
    Sorry, yes my mistake the sale of goods act does not apply to services, however the supply of goods and services act does.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: Paul_Rosser Member since: Jul 5, 2012
    #10
  11. businessfunding

    businessfunding Guest

    Posts: 0 Likes: 0
    As ever, The Resolver has sound advise

    In a nutshell, you now have 'possession' - which we all know is 9 points of the law.

    If you make a sensible offer of payment in a clear and rational manner it is very likely that they will accept; the legal process might prove costly and embarrassing for them to pursue.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: businessfunding Member since: Jan 1, 1970
    #11
  12. The Resolver

    The Resolver UKBF Ace Full Member

    Posts: 2,827 Likes: 917
    Oops- yes thanks for the correction Mike - read in a hurry. I would still give the same advice... they were the experts and knew the height of the required lift.

    As to the portakabin, I don't think one needs to be an expert in portakabins for your client to expect you to appreciate that they need levelling.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: The Resolver Member since: Mar 31, 2006
    #12
  13. fattony

    fattony UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    Posts: 624 Likes: 25
    Thanks for the replies.

    Yes this was agreed verbally as I had seen it I didnt think it would take more than a couple of hours to move it, which it didnt.

    I've just checked on google maps and it shows its 19.4 miles and 27 minutes from the contractors yard to the site, now bearing in mind this is a lorry I suspect it will take 45 mins as it wont be doing 70 mph on the motorway.

    I think Im going to write to them and offer to pay 2 hours travel and 2 hours on site, which is what I initially thought it would be.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: fattony Member since: Jul 16, 2009
    #13
  14. internetspaceships

    internetspaceships Banned Full Member

    Posts: 6,982 Likes: 2,328
    You gave them an open ended contract to do the job.

    I'm sorry but I struggle to see how you can go back and argue with what they charged.

    Tell me, how would you feel if you had a client who paid you the amount he thought you were worth?

    Think about that please before replying because it's important. Put yourself in their shoes.
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: internetspaceships Member since: Sep 7, 2009
    #14
  15. fattony

    fattony UKBF Enthusiast Free Member

    Posts: 624 Likes: 25
    well if we're comparing it then I wouldn't expect my clients to pay me while I went and got a different drill for as the one I assumed would be man enough wasn't, I also wouldn't leave site with something that wasn't level.

    While I understand where your coming from I hired in a professional company and believe I received a Mickey Mouse service
     
    Posted: Aug 4, 2012 By: fattony Member since: Jul 16, 2009
    #15
  16. internetspaceships

    internetspaceships Banned Full Member

    Posts: 6,982 Likes: 2,328
    Tony I'm not picking a scuffle mate.

    All I'm suggesting is that it should have all been nailed down properly prior to the job being done. No assumptions. Kinda like the way you contract your own goods and services out.

    We've all made the mistake. I did it last month too and it cost me big. My own fault, but I had to man up, pay up, and move along.
     
    Posted: Aug 5, 2012 By: internetspaceships Member since: Sep 7, 2009
    #16