Marketing Advice Needed

idv · Oct 22, 2008

Hi

I have a problem, our service is designed for the hotel industry.

We offer the hotel free advertising by the way of a detailed listing on our website and they only pay for results i.e. when a customer makes a booking at their hotel from our website we charge the hotel a small booking fee or if they choose to offer gift vouchers we allow them to sell these online through our website (which is an additional marketing channel for their business) and we take a small commission charge.

They also get advanced tools such as CRM all for free.

However which is the best approach of convincing/persuading these hotels to take a free listing on our website?

Because several venues have said no, which I find strange as it is free marketing/advertising for them, which will help increase their customer base/profits and builds greater awareness for their business online.

The approach I have been using is cold calling venues to ask for the owner/manager and for their email/postal address so we can send them more information on our free service, along with details to sign up to our website and terms and conditions which they have to sign.

Is there a better approach?

directmarketingadvice · Oct 22, 2008

I've done marketing work in the hotel industry.

There are a load of websites that offer what you're suggesting. Many of these sites are populated from one or two central databases.

So, hotel owners just have to list with a couple of services and they'll get lots of exposure.

With a new site, unless you can convince them you're going to be huge, why would they go to the trouble of putting a listing with you?

(even if they think you're going to be huge, they could just wait until that happens, there's no incentive to act now)

So, that's your problem.

It's not the form of marketing you're using, it's that you're not offering them anything to get excited about.

(also, how does your commission rate compare to the bigger services?)

Hope this helps,

Steve

Oct 22, 2008

This is the right appraoch I think, maybe you have not got the right message or not getting across in the right way.At the end of the day if they are only paying when you send busines their way...WHY WOULDNT THEY SIGN UP!!!

Id be more than happy to discuss us doing some work with you, its something we have lots of experience with.

Michael

brianbeecroft · Oct 22, 2008

Hi

I would recommend some targeted direct mailing prior to your phone calls this would at least warm up your cold calls. There is certaily something to be said about the psychological benefit of receiving tactile information prior to a cold call. It is also very important to get the design of the mailer correct. I know direct mail does have a bit of a bad rep but it does work. Cost don't need to be huge and you dont need to send huge number either. Have a look at our website to give you an idea of prices.

www.quickle.com

All the best

Brian

idv · Oct 22, 2008

Hi All

Thankyou all for your feedback so far

Steve - Our commission rates are the lowest on the web, and we are building partnerships with Tourist Boards for increased exposure/booking opportunities for the venues that list on our website.

We also offer them a greater range of free optional services along with the bookings such as gift vouchers, special offers, CRM system, customer survey/feedback system etc

What would you recommend to convince them to join us, as our website is innovative and offers more than the competition and is more cost effective (lower commission rates)

With our listing we manage most of the work for them, leaving them get on with what the new best - running their hotels. All they need to fill in is a data capture form with their hotel details, facilities, description, photos that we use to build their website on our site and to send the signed T+C's back to us. (BTW we complete a vase majority of the form for them and most of the form is just ticking checkboxes)

They also let us know room availability which they can change with a simple call to our service centre or online and they are able to take bookings.

Michael /Brian - I think our marketing leaflet we send them covers what we offer them very well, however I would be interested in your feedback if you are available to take a quick look?

Finally after sending this information and data capture form out to the venues, do you find it strange that we are having to make further calls to chase them up to complete the data capture form, or is this normal?

zsazsab · Oct 23, 2008

idv said:
Hi

I have a problem, our service is designed for the hotel industry.

We offer the hotel free advertising by the way of a detailed listing on our website and they only pay for results i.e. when a customer makes a booking at their hotel from our website we charge the hotel a small booking fee or if they choose to offer gift vouchers we allow them to sell these online through our website (which is an additional marketing channel for their business) and we take a small commission charge.

They also get advanced tools such as CRM all for free.

However which is the best approach of convincing/persuading these hotels to take a free listing on our website?

Because several venues have said no, which I find strange as it is free marketing/advertising for them, which will help increase their customer base/profits and builds greater awareness for their business online.

The approach I have been using is cold calling venues to ask for the owner/manager and for their email/postal address so we can send them more information on our free service, along with details to sign up to our website and terms and conditions which they have to sign.

Is there a better approach?

We've been using email marketing for sometime now and we get most of our leads from it. It's always good to send some introductory information about your good/service prior to calling. This should give them time to think about your offer, and even check your website. You can then expect a warmer response on the phone.

directmarketingadvice · Oct 23, 2008

Let me "step into the shoes of" a hotel owner I wrote copy for:

idv said:
Steve - Our commission rates are the lowest on the web, and we are building partnerships with Tourist Boards for increased exposure/booking opportunities for the venues that list on our website.

Commission only counts if you actually get them bookings.

How many unique visitors did your site get last week? How many bookings did that result in?

That's what he would want to know.

As for "building" partnerships, come back when you've gotten some sort of priority position with my local tourist board.

What would you recommend to convince them to join us, as our website is innovative and offers more than the competition and is more cost effective (lower commission rates)

Firstly, the word "innovative" is a ghastly word to use because it's too close to "another thing where you need to take the time to learn something to be able to use it". If it's unique, say "unique".

Secondly, what does he need to hear?

Bookings.

He needs to see evidence that you're making money for hotel owners like him and feel that, if he doesn't work with you, he's going to be losing out.

All they need to fill in is a data capture form with their hotel details, facilities, description, photos that we use to build their website on our site and to send the signed T+C's back to us.

i.e. he has to do a whole load of stuff.

Listen, I hear your "all it will cost him is a little bit of his time, so he's got nothing to lose" argument.

You're not the first person to come on here and ask "why don't people want my free thing/why won't they sign up to my free directory/try my risk free offer?".

You'll find lots of those threads in the archives.

IMO, there are two main reasons:

(1) We're bombarded with free "offers" and "opportunities" all day long and that we've learned that most are just a waste of time.

(2) No-one can be bothered being a guinea pig. If the directory/product/offer turns out to be any good, we'll hear about it and then we'll be able to change our minds.

So, in the case of your site, if it works out, people will want a listing.

But, why bother making the effort to list right now when they could just list after you're successful?

Steve

idv · Oct 23, 2008

Steve

The website is not live at the moment, it's due to launch in November to consumers, we are just trying to build up the hotel base on the website so it is of use to consumers when it goes live.

I know exactly what you are saying regarding site visitors and bookings and its something we can't give them right now. However our team have 8 years proven SEO skills and we will be running a high profile advertising campaign online and offline with endorsements from top sport stars in the country, which will help us reach consumers and therefore bookings at the venues listed on our site.

it's difficult to show evidence that we're making money for hoteliers as we are not live, how would you recommend how I would portray if they dont sign up they will be losing out? as the site has no proven results, although it will when it is up and running, guaranteed.

With the 'whole load of stuff' they have to do as you put it, what do you recommend?

You also said "But, why bother making the effort to list right now when they could just list after you're successful?"

If this is the case how did the likes of expedia, lastminute or even Mr and Mrs Smith start out if all hotels etc took that viewpoint!

directmarketingadvice · Oct 23, 2008

idv said:
how would you recommend how I would portray if they dont sign up they will be losing out?

They're not losing out. That's the problem.

With the 'whole load of stuff' they have to do as you put it, what do you recommend?

I suppose you could do your SEO, get to p1 for key high traffic terms and then promote the site to hotels based on actual traffic?

You also said "But, why bother making the effort to list right now when they could just list after you're successful?"

If this is the case how did the likes of expedia, lastminute or even Mr and Mrs Smith start out if all hotels etc took that viewpoint!

Surely you should know the answer to this. It's called "market research".

If I were starting a business, I'd find out how comparable companies became really successful.

It's called "cutting out some of the trial and error and using what's been proven to work".

However, I realise that's not a very popular approach and most business owners prefer the idea of reinventing the wheel, even though that means (a) it takes more time and money to achieve success and (b) it massively increases the likelihood of failure.

Sorry for being hard on you, but you're missing the point.

And, that point is, as things stand, your offer is weak and people are, quite rightly, turning it down.

So, it's not "how do I present this offer in a better way?", it's "how do I bring an offer to the table that people are going to want?".

Steve

idv · Oct 23, 2008

Hi Steve

I agree with you and that's what I have done, I am not trying to invent the wheel, but offer them an additional marketing channel for their business through our website.

I have also researched the market in depth as you suggested, the problem is getting the venues coming on board, how is the offer weak? when it is comparable with other services online, but we are more cost effective and offer more advanced tools.

How is the offer weak? and what ideas would you have for your statement

"how do I bring an offer to the table that people are going to want?".?

The search functionality on the site is more sophisticated than other competitors and delivers more targeted results. The site is the next evolution in online hotel search and booking.

We will also create significant consumer awareness this year, through marketing activity by December.

And we are already offering the hotels
No risk! marketing with no upfront costs - pay only on results
incentives for customers to book at their hotel and increase loyalty
increase their exposure locally and nationally etc

directmarketingadvice · Oct 23, 2008

idv said:
How is the offer weak?

Ok, here's a question for you: why do you think I think your offer is weak?

Steve

idv · Oct 23, 2008

The only reason I can see is that we are not an established website (as we are not live yet) so there are no traffic figures, how much money we have generated for partners etc yet?

Mr. Mu · Oct 23, 2008

idv, I've been in the feedback business for years, as a business consultant, as a trainer, as a lecturer. I'd say that your biggest obstacle is your attachment to your assumptions about the benefits / value of your proposition.

The first mistake here is to call anything that requires my time, effort or me giving up data 'free'. It isn't, it's a transaction - a sale. It has a cost. For that transaction to appeal to me it has to offer me irresistible benefits in return.

If people have turned down your free offer, it's simply because for them the benefits either don't exist or aren't compelling enough to match the cost. End of discussion.

Until we are prepared to accept that our assumptions may be wrong, we can't start finding out what would work.

If we can accept that, then we can go back to those prospects and ask them what kinds of things they would see as benefits that would make signing up to your system worth their while.

adventurelife · Oct 24, 2008

When their is value for the customer they will sign up.

Here is the crunch though

You cannot decide what is value for the customer. Only they can.

The world is crowded and everyone is fighting for a little bit of attention from everyone else to show their bit of value. It is getting much harder to do, therefore your value to the customer has to be much higher than other websites doing the same thing.

In my opinion ( most opinions are worthless you should research facts) you have entered a " me too" market space and there is nothing wrong with that but you will need to create a customer value that they can relate too and will mean that they will sign up.

directmarketingadvice · Oct 24, 2008

I agree with the last two posters, but I'd just like to clarify, the benefits aren't there for the prospects at the moment.

It doesn't mean they won't be there in the future.

If you've got a high traffic site that's producing lots of bookings, you've got an effective sales proposition.

But, to have that, you need lots of hotels...

So, you're in a chicken and egg situation.

Here's one possible solution: there are lots of hotel booking sites that are affiliates of bigger companies (which is where they get their database from).

You could sign up with one of those, SEO the site so it gets lots of traffic (as SEO seems to be your chosen form for marketing). Then, once you've gotten high rankings and are getting lots of traffic, producing lots of bookings, you can go back to the hotels individually and offer them a lower commission if they sign up with you.

It'll take a long time to do this, but it's one way of proving to the hotels that you can deliver what you say you can.

Hope this helps,

Steve

idv · Oct 24, 2008

Mr Mu

Thanks for your comments, however can you explain what you mean by your statement and how would you recommend this be addressed?

"I'd say that your biggest obstacle is your attachment to your assumptions about the benefits / value of your proposition.?"

I also don't agree with your statement "The first mistake here is to call anything that requires my time, effort or me giving up data 'free'. It isn't, it's a transaction - a sale. It has a cost. For that transaction to appeal to me it has to offer me irresistible benefits in return."

As all they have to do is take 5 mins to complete a data capture form, after that everything is managed for them? What would the irresistable benefits be to you if you was a business I was offering this free service to?

Steve - thanks once more for your comments, and agree with you that I am in a chicken and egg situation, and can see what you are saying with becoming an affiliate but our website offers them much more than online reservations.

But is this possible/advisable just to get a base of venues on the site? - just advertise the venues details without contacting the venue first to see if they want to be listed on the website containing photos, features, customer reviews like what the likes of yelp.com and qype.com but in much more depth and then contact the venues when we have built up our traffic/user base to see if they want to use our online booking service etc?

Mr. Mu · Oct 25, 2008

Hi idv

What do I mean?

I mean that very often we assume that because we believe that our proposition offers x, y and z benefits, so will our prospects.

I mean that very often we assume that because we believe that '5 mins' plus data is a fair exchange for those benefits, so will our prospects.

We all make those assumptions at some point. The important question is what we do when we get evidence back that contradicts them.

If people don't want your proposition it's because the benefits you assume it offers:

- aren't benefits
or
- are unclear
or
- aren't equal to the effort required

What do I mean by 'attachment'? How far and how long and hard we're prepared to fight to retain our belief in the benefits of our proposition in the face of evidence and feedback to the contrary.

directmarketingadvice · Oct 25, 2008

idv said:
Mr Mu

I also don't agree with your statement "The first mistake here is to call anything that requires my time, effort or me giving up data 'free'. It isn't, it's a transaction - a sale. It has a cost. For that transaction to appeal to me it has to offer me irresistible benefits in return."

I agree with Mr Mu on this one.

As all they have to do is take 5 mins to complete a data capture form, after that everything is managed for them? What would the irresistable benefits be to you if you was a business I was offering this free service to?

For me, it would be traffic and some sort of track record of producing bookings from the site.

Steve - thanks once more for your comments, and agree with you that I am in a chicken and egg situation, and can see what you are saying with becoming an affiliate but our website offers them much more than online reservations.

Well, right now, it doesn't even offer them that.

But is this possible/advisable just to get a base of venues on the site? - just advertise the venues details without contacting the venue first to see if they want to be listed on the website containing photos, features, customer reviews like what the likes of yelp.com and qype.com but in much more depth and then contact the venues when we have built up our traffic/user base to see if they want to use our online booking service etc?

It's an option and similar to my "start as an affiliate" idea.

The differences are:

(1) It'll take a hell of a lot more work to get the content on the site (e.g. how are you going to get reviews?)

(2) You don't get paid for the first x months of the site's existence.

But, that doesn't mean it isn't the better long-term solution.

Steve

mikelaluz · Oct 25, 2008

idv said:
Hi Steve

"how do I bring an offer to the table that people are going to want?".?

The search functionality on the site is more sophisticated than other competitors and delivers more targeted results. The site is the next evolution in online hotel search and booking.

And we are already offering the hotels
No risk! marketing with no upfront costs - pay only on results
incentives for customers to book at their hotel and increase loyalty
increase their exposure locally and nationally etc

You are in a very tough market with established players doing an ok job for the hoteliers.

Presuming that your USP is contained in the above - how are you communicating that to your target audience? Your biggest problem in all of this is having delivered the pitch you get every marketers nightmare answer 'So What!'

I suggest plenty of testing and more testing because untill you have results and testimonial evidence you are fighting massive apathy as you are trying to solve a problem that in their mind does not exist. Your solution may have all the bells and whistles but if it's not needed (and perception is everything) it's irrelevant.

My approach would be as you suggested earlier an inclusion unless otherwise advised which from a cost/time perspective with skilled telemarketing could soon build up the desired base. And with Christmas - Easter - Summer approaching you need a live site to service demand and to remove the egg from the chicken once and for all.

Regards
Mike

brianbeecroft · Oct 25, 2008

Hi

I would generally agree with what has been said here, particularly Mr Mu.

In a previous life I used to own a hotel all but a small one and a few years ago. I was contacted almost on a weekly basis from new websites promising me loads of new income. I did sign up for a few but in the end I found it too time consuming with little in return. In time I filtered out the sites, mainly by seeing the design of the site and usability of it from a customers point of view.

My companies now are contacted on a weekly bases for online advertising, and I still use the same criteria to filter these websites. But I also now ask the sales person the question. "Will your site give me cost effective ROI" they always say "yes". I would then say "prove it, if it is as good as what you say I would be mad not to sign up with you" I would then ask for a month free so I could evaluate their performance. If they performed well I would certainly keep with them. The websites that say no I don't book with, if they don't have confidence in their site why should I.

As Mr Mu stated, free isn't always about not paying money, hoteliers time is very precious to them. Why not balance this with a commission free period or a set amount of commission free bookings. If your site is going to be as good as you say, prove it, they would be mad not to keep with you

Brian Beecroft
www.quickle.com

Mwebb · Oct 25, 2008

As an alternative, and giving you an instant database, why don't you get in contact with hotels.com They haev a few options: Affiliate program, and take half the commission they get I believe; or i also think theyallow you to use their database, and produce a whole new site, charge your own booking fees etc.

I think www.bootsnall.com work this way. [ Only because I booked all my hostels when travelling through them, and when arriving at the hostel they said we booked through hotels.com / hostelworld/ who ever-but basically the main database provider]

my website has a similar issue. The motor trade has established marketing channels, and getting dealers to set up new one is difficult....even if it is free, and you are top of google, above autotrader/fish4/ exchange and mart for a lot of keywords.

Therefore you need to work with the existing datafeeds, and find a way to make money from it. It also gives you the opportunituy to say: We created X amount of bookings last week for competitors in your area, in the value of X. Would you like to talk to you regards how we can help you get some of that revenue from your competitors?

My initial problem was not realising "free" is not a USP. You need to pitch to people in a way that they expect to have to pay for your service. Then once they have "brought" you, you let them know it's free. Then nobody says no!

steviemac · Oct 25, 2008

the truth is businesses' are simply weary of getting calls everyday about the 'next big' website or your new magazine or newspaper. They get maybe 3 or 4 calls every day, and are fed up with it. I say this as someone who comes from an advertising background.

When selling advertising on our top Northern Ireland magazine we had an advantage because we were known everywhere in N.Ireland, and even we got the going tough. So how much tougher is it for new start-ups ringing round businesses? It's a nightmare, because unless a business recognises the magazine or website asan established name, they switch off almost immediately.

idv · Oct 26, 2008

Hi All

The best approach I think and as echoed by Mike and Steve is to list the hotels details on the website the best we can (so they get free advertising) build up our visitor base when it launches and via telemarketing/direct mail try and convert these venues to offer their rooms to be booked online through our website.

Steve - With reviews allow them to post reviews the same as they can on yelp or qype.

I have also written a letter which I was going to send to the chains i.e. Hilton, Marriott, Best Western etc along with the marketing leaflet on what we offer to see if they are interested in using the website, and perhaps offer them the first 10 bookings free along with some banner adverts on the site for the first month for free as well to try and tempt them to sign up with us. I have the correct contacts for the people who I will be sending this information to at these chains but would be interested to hear advice or even if this is a good idea? I was going to follow up the letter with a phone call a few days later.

Search

Search

Marketing Advice Needed

idv

directmarketingadvice

brianbeecroft

idv

zsazsab

directmarketingadvice

idv

directmarketingadvice

idv

directmarketingadvice

idv

Mr. Mu

adventurelife

directmarketingadvice

idv

Mr. Mu

directmarketingadvice

mikelaluz

brianbeecroft

Mwebb

steviemac

idv

Similar threads

Latest Articles