Witholding personal property?

One of the lads · Mar 12, 2008

Sorry to be vague about this, but can't risk post being found by others involved.

I'm leaving the employ of a company. When I joined the company I brought some equipment with me which was used by me initially, and then later by another employee as my role changed. Some of this equipment is rarely used and is stored at the company's offices, the remainder is stored at the home of the employee who is using it, or in their company vehicle. As I'm leaving I would like all the equipment back, but the company is refusing to agree that it's mine. They are demanding that I show receipts for each item. Much of the equipment has been handed down to me over the years, some of it was bought second-hand for cash etc., so I can't provide receipts. Of course, as the equipment is mine, the company hasn't got receipts either. Where do I go from here?

AdamJ · Mar 12, 2008

If its a stalemate going for professional legal advice would be my recommendation.

PI Guy · Mar 12, 2008

can't you just take your property back. If it's yours take it back. If it's inaccessible then call the old bill and report the theft of your property.

If however it's not your property then it would be theft if you took it. There's really no grey area here. Either it's your property or it's not.

AdamJ · Mar 12, 2008

I'm not sure about that approach - if he can't prove its his via receipts or some other documentation then Mr. Plod isn't going to go charging in to recover it, especially if the employer says its theirs and not his. I think a little more careful approach is needed, and on the basis of some professional advice.

One of the lads · Mar 12, 2008

Thanks for the responses guys. The goods aren't accessible to me. I have plenty of people who have seen me using the equipment in the distant past, and who would state it was mine, but I don't think that's good enough.

My issues with going down a legal representation route immediately are firstly that I can't afford it (see my other posts about the nightmare that is my working life) but don't have access to Legal Aid, and secondly I don't want to start from a position of no knowledge. Can anyone point me in the direction of some case notes or some guidance publications on this subject?

Manda · Mar 12, 2008

Do you have any photographs that prove that you own the equipment, my husband often goes into the garage with a camera and photographs things for insurance purposes, do you have any pictures of you using the equipment that predates your employment with the said company? We once had to prove that X tool was stolen from us and lack of paperwork was making it difficult till I remembered he was using it to build our first furniture and as a result I had taken photographs of his total dispare giving us proof.

One of the lads · Mar 12, 2008

Unfortunately not. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

One of the lads · Mar 13, 2008

I now have an email from my employer which, in my eyes, accuses me of trying to defraud the company of it's assets! Would one of the legal eagles on here be good enough to have have a look and give me some advice re: defamation, libel etc.?

AdamJ · Mar 13, 2008

Just yet another lay-person non-specialist guess, but can you claim libel / defamation if its a private e-mail / correspondence between two people? I would have thought that to show loss it would have to be a public statement?

Paul Kelly ICHYB · Mar 13, 2008

Put the onus on the company to prove they purchased the property.

Being a legal entity, they have to keep their records for several years!

Also, a formal letter advising them that you will go legal if the property is not returned (or 'reasonable' compensation) may make them take your views a little more serious!

maxine · Mar 13, 2008

Have you tried just phoning your local police station for their advice?

One of the lads · Mar 13, 2008

AdamJ said:
Just yet another lay-person non-specialist guess, but can you claim libel / defamation if its a private e-mail / correspondence between two people? I would have thought that to show loss it would have to be a public statement?

Take your point, but that's why I'm asking the question, I don't know what action I can take. Email was actually copied to the board of directors, how public does it have to be?

AdamJ · Mar 13, 2008

No idea mate, but I would be surprised if that counted - its still a private circulation. Even if you did have a smidgen of a case if I were you I'd concentrate my fighting effort on getting my stuff back. Getting diverted into a libel issue (which as a non-expert I would still think this falls far short of) will just make everyone dig their heels in harder.

Ashley · Mar 13, 2008

if your firm of your convictions it can be very easy to get them back, but it is a punt, advice will depend what you consider the assessed value of the goods are?

Ashley · Mar 13, 2008

OH forgot do you want:

1) goods only
or
2) goods failing that the assessed value

this is important, if it went to court you would have to clearly say at the outset which you want and the enforcement of a judgement is different for both.

Jezclayton · Mar 13, 2008

Isn't there a saying "possession is nine tenths of the law". Since neither of you can prove ownership of the goods and they're not in your possession it might just be time to move on.

One of the lads · Mar 14, 2008

Ashley said:
OH forgot do you want:

1) goods only
or
2) goods failing that the assessed value

this is important, if it went to court you would have to clearly say at the outset which you want and the enforcement of a judgement is different for both.

About £1000. Assessed value would be OK, but I'd be concerned about ever getting the money, several other issues over money with the company. What's the way forward?

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Witholding personal property?

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