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Which software is most popular with small businesses today? Freelancer wants to know.

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spencergate

spencergate

Free Member
Apr 18, 2006
538
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Nottingham
I am looking for freelance bookkeeping/accounts admin work, and plan to contact accountants in my area.

I have a degree in Business Studies and finance, can produce accounts up to balance sheet, so qualified above AAT standard. I've got 20 odd years experience in installing computerised accountancy systems in all sorts of businesses, and of training users. Over the last 6 months I've done 3 temp general accountancy jobs, I have a good knowledge of Sage Accounts and TAS Books, and I'm good at credit control (our own business for 10 years). I am also able to teach people how to use Microsoft office (Microsoft accredited trainer), and can produce automated spreadsheets in Excel.

I want to continue to be self employed, to give me a bit more control over my hours (altho' I'm reliable for clients of course).

So I was thinking of canvassing local accountancy firms to see if they have any capacity to use my services on an occasional basis, or suggest I help out day-to-day for any of their clients. I can of course help with anyone implementing a computerised system for the first time.

Just wondered if I needed to brush up any other software products to make me more desirable?
 
There's always a shortage of people who know about Quickbooks - it is a very popular package, often bought by small business owners, but relatively few accountants and book-keepers know how to use it properly.

Also the new generation of web-based packages, such as KashFlow (advertised on this site) and www.winweb.co.uk - both up and coming popular packages.
 
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Thank you Philip, I had completely overlooked Quickbooks, and will take a look at the others mentioned.

Do you think accountants may know of people who can use my services? How should I make my approach?
 
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I would think that lots of the smallest accountancy practices (one-man bands) will be very interested. The larger High Street firms probably won't be because they'll be training up their own staff in-house to do client book-keeping as another profit-centre so won't be keen to outsource or recommend others to their clients

The one-man bands are probably more inclined to off load as much work as possible to others so that they don't have to do the basics and can concentrate on accounts prep, tax, business development etc. I am often searching for local book-keepers to help out my clients, but they seem to be an endangered species - plenty around who can do Sage, but nothing else. The only ones who can do Quickbooks seem to live miles away which is no good when the client needs someone at their premises to update their data on their computer! I've been searching for what seems like years to find someone who is competent with quickbooks, but always seem to end up stuck with doing it myself.

You need to write to the smallest firms of accountants in your locality, briefly tell them who you are, what you do and what you are looking for. I'm sure you'll get some positive feedback.
 
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Philip, thank you, that is most encouraging. Shame you are not in Nottinghamshire, otherwise we could help each other out.

Off to price up a copy of Quickbooks, and compose an introductory letter.

I was planning on approaching the smaller accountants in my area, looks like I'm getting something right, at least.
 
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Philip Hoyle said:
The one-man bands are probably more inclined to off load as much work as possible to others so that they don't have to do the basics and can concentrate on accounts prep, tax, business development etc. I am often searching for local book-keepers to help out my clients, but they seem to be an endangered species - plenty around who can do Sage, but nothing else. The only ones who can do Quickbooks seem to live miles away which is no good when the client needs someone at their premises to update their data on their computer! I've been searching for what seems like years to find someone who is competent with quickbooks, but always seem to end up stuck with doing it myself.
.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. If I has someone local with the right experience, and knowledge of Quickbooks I'd snap them up.
 
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Ah, now, there is the conundrum. What is the right price? Is £10 per hour too much for basic bookkeeping, more like £16 per hour for setting up new computer systems?
 
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DFL, thanks. I know I'm not local to you, but I value the ability to ask for guidance from you, knowing it doesn't oblige either of us.

I am ordering a copy of quickbooks simple, and will run a years worth of accounts on it (taking the history of our business), It'll probably take me 3 or 4 weeks, to make sure I cover all aspects, but then I'll have enough experience to sell my services on that product.
when I've got some business I can grab a copy of quickbooks pro and do that too.
 
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spencergate said:
DFL, thanks. I know I'm not local to you, but I value the ability to ask for guidance from you, knowing it doesn't oblige either of us.

I am ordering a copy of quickbooks simple, and will run a years worth of accounts on it (taking the history of our business), It'll probably take me 3 or 4 weeks, to make sure I cover all aspects, but then I'll have enough experience to sell my services on that product.
when I've got some business I can grab a copy of quickbooks pro and do that too.
Click to expand...

Don't forget that simplestart is limited....for example it can only do cash accounting based vat :)
 
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Thanks Alpha for pointing that out.

Hmm, my last year's accounts will be a bit different then, if I re-create them and do the VAT as cash accounting. Still it all makes for good practice, and if it is what many small businesses will use, fair enough.
 
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OK Spence

I have got some very good training manuals for QB Pro floating around the office somewhere which go through practical exercises.

You sound the type that will learn quickly and these will help you on the arears most needed.

PM me if you want one - that's presuming that I can find them, will have a look later on this afternoon.
 
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spencergate said:
Ah, now, there is the conundrum. What is the right price? Is £10 per hour too much for basic bookkeeping, more like £16 per hour for setting up new computer systems?
Click to expand...

Surly a good bookkeeper is worth more than £10/hr.
If the book-keeping is not accuate and timely compliance is impossible. With the minimum wage at £5.52 adjusted for class4 NIC lets say £6.00/hr and you are using your power, resources, provision for pension etc. You are expected to take responsibility for work, as well as keep up to date; so do you really value bookkeeping at just above the equivalent mimimum wage level?
 
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pxt001 said:
Surly a good bookkeeper is worth more than £10/hr.
If the book-keeping is not accuate and timely compliance is impossible. With the minimum wage at £5.52 adjusted for class4 NIC lets say £6.00/hr and you are using your power, resources, provision for pension etc. You are expected to take responsibility for work, as well as keep up to date; so do you really value bookkeeping at just above the equivalent mimimum wage level?
Click to expand...

Paul, thanks for that comment. I was thinking of trying to charge £12 per hour, but it is difficult to know where to pitch. After all, I'd rather get 4 hours work at £12, than none at all priced at £13.50
Furthermore, my ltd company is VAT registered, so I'd have to charge VAT, altho' that is hopefully irrelevant to most clients.
 
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It depends on area and client - but your fees do seem low.

You could charge by one of three ways

1. By Hour

Upside: You know where you are and you get paid in accordance with your time. Downside is that some clients do not appreciate the time it takes to do things properly and question hours spent.

2. Fixed Fee

Upside is that you get more for efficiency, easy to sell to client as they know where they stand. Downside is that if underestimate or volume increases then you lose out. Define bands to alleviate this problem.

3. Per item

Charge a fixed price (50p?) per entry. Get a quick bookkeeping system that you master and can process accurately and speedily. Upside: Hugely increase hourly rate whilst retaining happy client. Downside? None. You are increasing remuneration due to efficient system - client is paying agreed price which he/she is happy with. Win-win.
 
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Another option is to have a volume discount so that you incentivise and reward those clients who use you the most. :)
 
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Oh Blimey. I hadn't thought of charging other than per hour.

I always hated charging a fixed fee when I was in I.T. consultancy, simply because I am an optimistic, sunny sort of soul, and always assumed a project would go well. By the time we had dealt with snags and tech faults, I always felt we had undervalued our time (stayed in profit tho' :)).

It never occurred to me to charge per item. I think to make that pay I need more experience in estimating transaction throughput.

So is £15 per hour nearer the mark? Certainly the client I have spoken to this morning (who has engaged my services) snapped up the £12 + VAT .

Which I don't mind too much, it's a company I already know and the working environment is SUPER.
 
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£15 is nearerer the mark, when you take downtime, expenses and any overheads into account you will need to make a reasonable profit. I would always go for a minmium of £15 per hour (when I am selling, not when buying :D) you can always discount for volume as mentioned.

Whatever the agreed price you need to ensure that both sides are happy with it, and that no one gains at the others expense. This will ensure that the relationship gets off to the right footing.

Hear what you say re fixed price, common problem, EVERY contingency needs to be though of and factored in. One way is to agree a fixed monthly price, get the client to pay by monthly standing order, and have a balance up every six months. Provide timesheets andcumalative figures on a monthly basis to ensure no nasty surprises.
 
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As a book-keeper I have been through the various methods of charging. I don't know why it is but I hate discussing rates and invoicing people but it has to be done.

I charge £15-£17.50 per hour as an experienced book-keeper. Most people find this ok. However I never take the mick like charging for every second and I will offer discount on larger volumes of work. Plus I never charge for initial meetings. A friend of mine who also is a book-keeper charges more than me plus for everything but I do not like this approach.

I do not have a lot of clients but most are at least a few days if more a month. I always contact all my clients by email/phone every two weeks or so if I do not see them. A lot of them love an imformal chat about business/home life as they just like to have someone to turn to who understands things. Sounds silly but it seems to work.

Derren Hotchkiss

www.dh-solutions.co.uk
 
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Thanks Derren.

Yes I'm sure it's better to be a 'friendly face', someone to chat to as well as just do the books, and I'll take your approach on board.

Why are we still here at 11 at night? Come on guys, get a life ;)

Night.
 
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It has been really interesting watching this thread develop - someone comes on without any idea of what they should be doing and three pages later they have business model to try. Amazing when you think about it......
 
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Yes Beauty, it's quite nice to see, isn't it? :)

Just a quick word about QB:

I love it. But older versions won't run on Windows Vista. I run Standard 2005 and it just won't work. Standard 2006 will work, I have been told, but haven't tried it yet. I also heard that in the 2007 (?) and 2008 versions, Intuit have dropped the standard package, leaving only SimpleStart (limited) and the £300-ish version. I won't be using QB past the 2006 version, as I dislike this approach.

I thoroughly dislike the way QB handles VAT. I'd always put a VAT registered business through SAGE Instant, mostly because the double entry is more visible and more hands-on.

As for fees, £15 ph at least. Apparently, £20 is the going rate in my area. Some accountants firms will say £25 is the going rate, but I've never seen this. I think most freelance bookkeepers say "I wish!" when they hear that!

It's worth bearing in mind that when you start out, you will be slower. As you get more hands-on experience, you will get quicker and more efficient. Think about how this will affect your income, especially if you charge by the hour. When I was bookkeeping, I started off at £10ph back in the beginning (in training and supervised) and gradually increased my rate as I felt I was worth it.

Best of luck.
 
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Another point I find with rates - for me its harder to put up rates after some time than start at the correct rate. As I mentioned I do not always like dealing with the charge out rate to clients so I would rather it set at an appropiate rate at the start.

Derren
 
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Oh I agree it's very hard to raise a rate for an existing client, once you are in you really have to bite the bullet and stick with it.

Jenni, I'm not that slow. I've been dealing with implementing new systems for years and have done more than my fair share of posting, plus 12 years of doing our ltd company accounts. I'm just 'down-shifting' a bit to be at home more.



BTW I'm really impressed with the help and advice I'm getting from everyone here too.
 
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I didn't mean to imply you were slow! It was just a consideration in case. :)
Edit: Oh god I did as well. Bad use of grammar for which I apologise *slaps self*

I agree raising a rate is not easy. I hated those discussions! ;)
 
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wow, what a thread!
reading this actually inspired me to join your network, so thanks for the topic Spencer.
I'm actually in the same boat setting up myself as a freelance accountant, although for me I'm in France, bilingual and really enjoy all the number analysis, interpretations and recommendands part of accounting too.
Hope your business quickly gets going.
Rachel
 
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This is a good thread.

I am a bookkeeper, based in Essex. I also have Quickbooks experience (hope DFL is reading, I am based in Ongar, so not far from you).

I also have Sage and MYOB experience and am now learning MS Office Accounting.

I charge £20 an hour and I believe I am worth it. I am ACCA qualified, but havent completed my 2 years post-qual experience, so can only do bookkeeping, but the knowledge helps me to be a good bookkeeper.

I have come accross some shocking work that "bookkeepers" have carried out, and I am horrified that businesses are subjected to this.

I think people think its easy to be a bookkeeper and set up as one as its a good thing to do from home with fairly low set up costs.

If you are a good bookkeeper, depending on location, I think you can charge more than £12-£13.

I am really enjoying being a bookkeeper, I love getting stuck into people's accounts and am confident I offer a very good service.

Nicola
 
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