New site effects on page rank?

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bitsnstuff

My friend is looking to set up a new website to replace her current site which has a page rank of 4. She is looking at Actinic as a possible option, so that she can set up and run the site by herself, however, she has just been told that if she has a site set up in HTML she would get up the rankings higher.

My question is - if she uses Actinic and simply exchange her current PR4 site for the new one using the same domain name would it have an adverse effect on her current rank?

All help appreciated.

Kate :lol:
 

DuaneJackson

Free Member
Jul 14, 2005
8,642
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Brighton / London
Hmm, a tricky one. Technically, no - no change on her rank becuase this is based on inbound links - not content.

There is also some relevance given to internal link structure (ie: how her pages all link to each other) So on the next update after her changes, there could be a drop in PR.

But what she is being told is true. A HTML site or optimised ecommerce system (or an optimised version of Actinic) would be a thousand times better than straight forward actinic catalog.

Whatever she does, if she is changing the site structure - tell her to make sure she deals with 404 (page not found) errors. Search engines and other sites will be linking to pages that exist now but may not further down the line. A "Custom 404" page would be the simplest solution.


How am I doing on the PLain English campaign? : )
 
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B

bitsnstuff

The plain english is fine!!! Thank you very much for making it understandable.

She is keen on the Actinic Catalog idea, so how would she turn that into an optimised version of Actinic? She understands how to use Actinic, so it will allow her to change the site whenever she wants to, rather than having to wait for someone else to change it.

Kate
 
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Srivvy

Free Member
May 24, 2005
118
4
UK
Hello Kate

Even if you keep your pagerank after a site redesign, you can still lose your rankings.

This is because search engines think that a complete redesign can indicate a change of owner and therefore business type or ethics.

This could be the case even if she keeps her PR4.

For this reason, if she relies on not losing her current results, it may be better to set up a new site to compliment (not copy!) the content within her old one.
 
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Agri-Hire

Free Member
Oct 11, 2005
157
2
Don't want to get too Technical, but.....

The formula uses a model of a random surfer who gets bored after several clicks and switches to a random page. The PageRank value of a page reflects the frequency of hits on that page by the random surfer. It can be understood as a Markov process in which the states are pages, and the transitions are all equally probable and are the links between pages. If a page has no links to another pages, it becomes a sink and therefore makes this whole thing unusable, because the sink pages will trap the random visitors forever. However, the solution is quite simple. If the random surfer arrives to a sink page, it picks another URL at random and continues surfing again.

To be fair with pages that are not sinks, these random transitions are added to all nodes in the Web, with a residual probability of usually q=0.15, estimated from the frequency that an average surfer uses his or her browser's bookmark feature.

So, the equation is as follows:


where p1,p2,...,pN are the pages under consideration, M(pi) is the set of pages that link to pi, L(pj) is the number of links coming from page pj, and N is the total number of pages.

The PageRank values are the entries of the dominant eigenvector of the modified adjacency matrix. This makes PageRank a particularly elegant metric: the eigenvector is


where R is the solution of the equation


where the adjacency function is 0 if page pj does not link to pi, and normalised such that, for each j


i.e. the elements of each column sum up to 1.

The values of the PageRank eigenvector are fast to approximate (only a few iterations are needed) and in practice it gives good results.

As a result of Markov theory, it can be shown that the PageRank of a page is the probability of being at that page after lots of clicks. This happens to equal t − 1 where t is the expectation of the number of clicks (or random jumps) required to get from the page back to itself.

The main disadvantage is that it favors older pages, because a new page, even a very good one, will not have many links unless it is part of an existing site (a site being a densely connected set of pages).

That's why PageRank should be combined with textual analysis or other ranking methods. PageRank seems to favor Wikipedia pages, often putting them high or at the top of searches for several encyclopedic topics. A common theory is that this is because Wikipedia is very interconnected, with each article having many internal links from other articles, which in turn have links from many other sites on the Web pointing to them. Compared to Wikipedia, and similar high quality content-rich sites, the rest of the World Wide Web is relatively loosely connected.

However, Google is known to actively penalize link farms and other schemes to artificially inflate PageRank. How Google tells the difference between highly inter-linked web sites and link farms is one of Google's trade secrets.



In other words, You are right Duane

:wink:
 
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Business Listing
Nov 4, 2005
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not wishing to hijack the thread but I have just launched my site (3 weeks ago) - how / when will it start getting a ranking. I have a few links set up for it (am trying to get more - help please?).
 
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elainec100 said:
not wishing to hijack the thread but I have just launched my site (3 weeks ago) - how / when will it start getting a ranking. I have a few links set up for it (am trying to get more - help please?).

It can take months to get a decent "organic" search engine result page (SERP) rank for your keyphrases, even when working through an SEO consultant.

First steps are:

Build links with other sites, relevant to your site but only those of good "pedigree".

Apply for DMOZ listing

Pagerank (something different than SERP rank), is related to the number of inbound links you have - so see above comment. We can provide a no obligation quote and competitor analysis, to help boost your "organic" search engine results. If you are interested, PM me.

Google in particular is not friendly to new sites and you may find that there is a long time between taking actions and seeing the results you expect. This is due to the Google "sandbox" effect on new sites, it affects most but not all new websites.
 
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welshnoonoo

Free Member
Mar 1, 2006
967
1
bitsnstuff said:
My friend is looking to set up a new website to replace her current site which has a page rank of 4. She is looking at Actinic as a possible option, so that she can set up and run the site by herself, however, she has just been told that if she has a site set up in HTML she would get up the rankings higher.

My question is - if she uses Actinic and simply exchange her current PR4 site for the new one using the same domain name would it have an adverse effect on her current rank?

All help appreciated.

Kate :lol:

Hi Kate -

The othe thing I would advise her to do is wherever possible, keep the page names the same. I don't know anything about Actinic but I am assuming it is a content management system which means the file extensions may not be htm/html an if her current site is then could she not integrate Actinic into the shop areas of the site only and keep the rest of the site static html?

If she knows which of her current pages draw in the most traffic then these ar the ones I would not change for now.

I would use a customised 404Error Page if she has pages that she definitely removes, but otherwise I would use a 301 Redirect.

Not sure if that helps at all!
 
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the thing to be considering as well for this site is the url strings

urls like <site name>/index.php?getstring=etc&getsrting2=etc

try to find a solutions that uses SEF so that your links will not have a GET string appearing as google hates this.

I dont know how atinic works, so ignore me if this is not an issue with it
 
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From what I remember Actinic does not have many search engine friendly aspects to it, in fact totally the opposite.

As far as the HTML element is concerned. To me the do the site in HTML thing gets thrown around way to much. Sites such as Dell, BBC all do well without having their sites as core HTML. At the end of the day, you can structure a site just as well using simple server side scripting and some common sense, as you can by doing things as HTML.
 
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welshnoonoo

Free Member
Mar 1, 2006
967
1
PeteYoung said:
As far as the HTML element is concerned. To me the do the site in HTML thing gets thrown around way to much. Sites such as Dell, BBC all do well without having their sites as core HTML.

Whilst I agree with you Pete, there are sites out there who have non-html pages that rank well, I don't think we can use Dell and the BBC sites as a comparison. These sites are likely to be classed as authority sites, and of course their marketing budget are such that they will be extremely popular sites anyway with thousands and thousands of backlinks and high, high traffic, this is probably enough to push them to the top of the pile alone!

I think for the average business on the street who wants to get their site ranking highly for carefully chosen keyword phrases, then the way forward is definitely to have html static pages within their site, even if, as you say, the core of the site is not.

However, I would love to see some examples of a site using an 0ff-the shelf content management package such as the one mentioned, ranking highly for a popular phrase. I would guess that those who rank well with dynamic pages are potentially bespoke packages.

Maybe it would be a useful exercise for those considering such packages?
 
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