Possible Fraud please help

[taggingsupplies]

Hi i have a customer wanting to purchase a few goods from myself which comes to £2,500.00 which is my largest order.

He wants to pay via bank transfer which i think is the safest way for me?

But im worried he trys to claim back after i ship the items can he?

Also what happens if the bank account has been hijacked? Can the proper owner of the account claim all the money back? im a bit concerned due to the amount involved..:|

[Stonelaughter]

I think that if you're suspicious I would ask them to pay by card and tell them you don't accept transfers. If they have the security code off the card then they have the card in their possession at least; whereas if they have simply stolen bank details then that is all they will have.

If he's set on paying by bank transfer then I believe that this is too risky - how many customers have you heard of, who have £2,500 to spend but won't use a card on their purchases? I would decline the order in these circumstances. Next thing is, he'll ask you to ship to an address in Guatemala or Nigeria...

That's another way, of course; get him to specify the shipping address before you accept the order/payment and refuse any changes after payment, as the contract is then "sealed".

p.s. Bank Transfer is absolutely NOT the safest way - Credit Card is, followed by Debit Card. I fully understand your suspicion as this is a well-known scam. Best way is to try and check out all the parts of the scam before accepting the contract - is the buyer in the UK, is the person making the order the person who owns the account, is the shipping address within a short distance of the card/account holder's address... etc.

[taggingsupplies]

OHHH
I am waiting on the money to arrive into my bank account.
Okay is there anyway i can check his sort code and account number is not being used ilegally?
And if it has been do i get that money taken back from my account or am i insured in anyway?

[Stonelaughter]

Unfortunately the bank probably won't talk to you about the account owner; however you could telephone your bank's Fraud section and explain to them what is happening and can they check it out and give you any assurances. They could theoretically arrange for contact with the account holder to ask them if they have ordered £2,500 worth of tagging gear. Don't send the items until you are absolutely assured that the person is who they say they are. Fob them off with stock excuses etc until you get those assurances.

[blackandwhite1986]

Is this a B2B or B2C transaction? Similairly is this an existing or new customer? If you are in the B2B bracket and it is a new customer i would suggest asking for a pro forma payment?

[deniser]

I have had customers wanting to pay by bank transfer because they are muslim and don't do credit cards and everything was fine. So it's not the method of payment that's suspect, it's the circumstances surrounding it.

A BACs transfer from a genuine account is free for the sender and recipient and easy to do. A credit card is safer for the buyer rather than the seller but maybe the buyer has no credit card or the limit is not high enough for this purchase? It's not necessarily dodgy. There are just as many security hoops to go through using someone else's bank details as there are with a stolen card.

If I were you I would check out the buyer - is he on the electoral roll for the delivery address, is his phone number registered there, that sort of thing. Check the names on the account when the money comes through to check they match up etc.

[Rhyl Lightworks]

Is this order going to the UK or abroad? I'd be very wary of certain countries.
Barrie

[consultant]

What are the goods?
Where is the customer?

"Bank Transfer is absolutely NOT the safest way - Credit Card is"

Where is this coming from? Bank transfer is a way of receiving guaranted funds into your account. If you are suspicious of the customer, do not complete the transaction.

As for credit cards, have you never heard of a chargeback?

My good, some will recomend Western Union soon!

[itaufait]

"Bank Transfer is absolutely NOT the safest way - Credit Card is"

Where is this coming from? Bank transfer is a way of receiving guaranted funds into your account.

That quote puzzled me too, but you beat me to it!

[itaufait]

If they have the security code off the card then they have the card in their possession at least

I'm afraid it doesn't, it means literally that - that you have the CV2 code from the card; just like knowing the PIN doesn't prove that the card is yours!

[OldWelshGuy]

many sites are set up selling products at a loss simply to snatch the credit card details so they can clone them online to make purchases!

[taggingsupplies]

Hi, Well spent 50 Minutes on the phone to get a half answer from the Royal bank of scotland, they said im not insured if someone later on says: Hey that money came from my account i want it back... MMMMMMMMMMM

So now what do i do, seems no way is safe for the seller, i mean its £2,500 i wish i just said cheque to him only.

Yes i dont think id be happy with a credit card as that can be anyones cloned card etc.

Hopefully he wont make the payment now.

[cjd]

The only guaranteed payment is cash.

Even a bank transfer can be recalled but it's very difficult after the cash has entered your account - he can't simply change his mind; he'd have to prove fraud or banking error.

Verified by Visa credit card payment is probably the safest method for a large payment atm although we tend to trust bank transfer - not had one go wrong yet and we genearlly only use it when we're doubtful of the customer.

[taggingsupplies]

Well here is the update the man has paid me and so far it is in my account, i asked my bank how was it paid: they said: it looks like it was a cash deposit.

So is there anyway now that i could still be defrauded in anyway? just before i send the goods?

But it looks very promosing unless i have missed something?

So to confirm i have the £2,500 in my bank now...

Thanks

[cjd]

Looks bomb proof to me - a cash transfer is pretty instant.

One final check would be to confirm that the amount in your bank is available for your use - ie not awaiting clearing (it shouldn't be) and confirm that the payee is using the same name etc that he used to make the purchase.

[taggingsupplies]

My bank manager told me to leave it tonight and call him in the morning just to make sure everything is okay, i will try and get the name of the person who transfered the cash but im not sure if i could manage that. Will keep everyone informed, cheers

[nigelmarsh]

credit score your customer carry on your score on the customer ,and then make a decision .

Bank transfer , Could to reversed , credit cards transactions can be claimed back ,
letter of credit is safe , but out of question on this value,

So you need to take a decision on what you know about the customer .

[itaufait]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned a banker's draft yet...

PS: Although if someone made me jump through all these hoops just so I can get something I'd happily go to someone else. Just use your common sense - if something doesn't feel right then it probably isn't; if you're just being paranoid, well, there's nothing anyone can do.

[taggingsupplies]

The man paid cash into another oryal bank of scotland today in London and my bank manager confirmed this in Scotland.
So am i right in saying this is 100% safe for me now?

[dragonfly]

This is where using a decent dedicated vehicle carrier can be useful. You are sending 2.5k of kit to someone you don't know. Send it with a sameday carrier, and specify proof of ID is required before delivery.

We do this for a couple of companies, and on occasion we have been known to photograph the ID on a mobile phone, and send it to the customer before unlocking the van.

Many overnight companies will say they offer the same service when asked, however their drivers have 70+ deliveries a day to do, and to be quite honest don't have the time, and won't bother in most cases.

[itaufait]

Is this a corporate or a private order?

[Stonelaughter]

The man paid cash into another oryal bank of scotland today in London and my bank manager confirmed this in Scotland.
So am i right in saying this is 100% safe for me now?

If he's paid cash into your account at the branch, then it's not "bank transfer" and therefore isn't a transaction which can be "clawed back". I would say that this is safe.

[nigelmarsh]

cash deposited directly into your account :) well done , very safe .

[taggingsupplies]

Dragonfly is that incase the driver gets robbed? Why do they need ID if the goods have been paid for in cash?

[dragonfly]

Sorry I was more refering to the Bank Transfer\Credit Card Scenario. Should have made it more clear.