New Startup - What can old company do to me?!

[DaveBar]

Hello All

First post, and quite a biggy question so hope you'll excuse me!!

I wonder if someone can help me please. I'm an IT engineer who has been with a company for 7 years. Recently changes have occured that I'm not happy with and I'm considering going it alone (after I've done lots more research!!).

My main question is that my employment contract does not mention any form of restriction post employment (or even during employment) and I'm double checking the consequences of me approaching the companies clients once I left - obviously they will be VERY annoyed and try things to stop me, but I'm just wondering what they could do from a legal standing.

I have a good relationship with all the clients I would look to take.

Does anyone have any words of advice, both in terms of what to do, and more importantly maybe, what NOT to do! Any help would be most appreciated!!

[consultant]

with contractual exclusions or making you agree something before you leave, there is little they can do.

[DaveBar]

with contractual exclusions or making you agree something before you leave, there is little they can do.

Thankyou for your quick reply. That's probably one ticked off the list. I'm sure i'll be back shortly..!!!

[Lime One]

If your contract does not provide for specific exclusions then there will not be much they can do about your new work. However approaching their clients for work is a big no no and likely to, if the company you leaving is minded to, to get you on the receiving end of an injunction to prevent you from doing this.

[DaveBar]

If your contract does not provide for specific exclusions then there will not be much they can do about your new work. However approaching their clients for work is a big no no and likely to, if the company you leaving is minded to, to get you on the receiving end of an injunction to prevent you from doing this.

Thanks for the reply. What would my options be? on what grounds would they get an injunction as i'd just be another IT company..?

[Lime One]

You would only know the clients, their buying patterns andthe contracts they have with your old company so most will regard it is a form of theft. It is sued under loss of earnings for the company losing the client.

Your options are limited but your clients are not, they can deal with whoever they want to but you need to take care how this is approached. Ideally taking specific legal advice on the way forward. Happy to help further if you email us.

[obscure]

Thanks for the reply. What would my options be? on what grounds would they get an injunction as i'd just be another IT company..?
One thing to be aware of is that they don't actually need to win and get the injunction to hurt you. The legal fees defending an action could seriously damage your new venture.

[DaveBar]

oh dear this isnt looking very good. heads they win tails i lose!

shame as the company has gone to the dogs and their customer care is bad.... we'll lose customers anyway.. hey ho!

[Stonelaughter]

Read LimeOne's comment again - there is potentially a way forward but they will need more info. GET ADVICE is the main thing...

[DaveBar]

limeone, just pm'd you. another possible scenario is being made redundant, does this confuse, help or hinder my predicament?

[The Dispute Resolver]

In the absence of a restraint clause, ex-employees can use fair methods to set up in business in competition. The courts prefer not to be too heavy with ex-employees. Its largely fair game and competition is what the economy is based on. But you have to tread carefully.

If you had a good relationship with the customers, then you can send round a standard email informing them you will no longer be working for the company after a certain date and wanted to write to say how much you enjoyed working for them and to wish them success in the future. You should cover yourself by saying you presume arrangements will be put in place to ensure they will continue to be well looked after by the company and that you have asked the company (do so in writing) to get in touch with you if there are any queries about your work from customers i.e. you will be available. Now somewhere in that you need to put (perhaps in parentheses after telling them you are leaving) something to say you are taking the brave step of setting up in business on your own.

You can set out the facts but you must take care in taking steps to solicit their business (even in the absence of a barring clause) - ie 'please instruct me as I am much better/cheaper than ..".

But don't do anything about the wording of the email without legal advice. My wording is just a suggestion of the sort of safer approach that can be taken. Of course if the number of customers is small why not just pick up the phone to say the above and see how the conversation goes (but record it in case there is a dispute?)

[DaveBar]

In the absence of a restraint clause, ex-employees can use fair methods to set up in business in competition. The courts prefer not to be too heavy with ex-employees. Its largely fair game and competition is what the economy is based on. But you have to tread carefully.

If you had a good relationship with the customers, then you can send round a standard email informing them you will no longer be working for the company after a certain date and wanted to write to say how much you enjoyed working for them and to wish them success in the future. You should cover yourself by saying you presume arrangements will be put in place to ensure they will continue to be well looked after by the company and that you have asked the company (do so in writing) to get in touch with you if there are any queries about your work from customers i.e. you will be available. Now somewhere in that you need to put (perhaps in parentheses after telling them you are leaving) something to say you are taking the brave step of setting up in business on your own.

You can set out the facts but you must take care in taking steps to solicit their business (even in the absence of a barring clause) - ie 'please instruct me as I am much better/cheaper than ..".

But don't do anything about the wording of the email without legal advice. My wording is just a suggestion of the sort of safer approach that can be taken. Of course if the number of customers is small why not just pick up the phone to say the above and see how the conversation goes (but record it in case there is a dispute?)

thank you so much for your time. does it change things if i left as a result of being made redundant, or do the same principles apply?

[The Dispute Resolver]

Redundancy doesn't change things in law albeit a court will be that much more supportive of your rights to compete given that the leaving was enforced rather than you leaving intentionally to set up in competition.

Additionally, as redundancy will reduce the capacity of the company to deliver services that may increase the reason for customers to transfer.

[DaveBar]

thanks for your reply. I'll be off to see a solicitor shortly!

[Tungstone]

dave

Be very careful about the "material" you hold, ie:

computer records
databases
Intelligence
etc

Your ex may threaten you with "theft" of intellectual property, private stuff
Be aware of this

[DaveBar]

dave

Be very careful about the "material" you hold, ie:

computer records
databases
Intelligence
etc

Your ex may threaten you with "theft" of intellectual property, private stuff
Be aware of this

I have heard this before, and a friend of mine got caught with this many years ago - a card index of records! In this day and age there is no information i have that i couldnt get from 'yell' about the companys - just email addresses/phone numbers .... how far does one take this? :|

[obscure]

In this day and age there is no information i have that i couldnt get from 'yell' about the companys - just email addresses/phone numbers .... how far does one take this? :|
Yes you could have got them from Yell but you didn't - The point is that these client contacts have a value - they were researched by your employer at their expense and relationships nurtured over time and again at your employers expense.

If you had done a search in Yell it wouldn't have just thrown up just these valuable contacts. It would also throw up many other companies that aren't interested. You would have had to invest time/effort/money into contacting them all in order to find the valuable few. You're seeking to benefit financially from your employers investment and it is possible they won't be pleased by this.

[yorkshirejames]

A bit of practical advice - create a profile on Linked In http://www.linkedin.com and invite a selection of your existing colleagues and clients to add you.

When you do leave, add your home email address, and change your profile so it shows you're now in business on your own.

[DaveBar]

just checked about my contract, and apparently i have no written contract at present, so i suppose it's all down to the general rules on what an ex-employee can do with customer knowldege of his/her employer??

[Tim R-T-C]

Did you ever sign a 'confidentiality clause'. I was asked to sign one last month - it included points that we would not reveal or use company information, nor company customers information (including the company names etc).

If you ever signed one of these, even just as part of your sign-up agreement, then it will carry as much weight as if it was in your contract.

[DaveBar]

Did you ever sign a 'confidentiality clause'. I was asked to sign one last month - it included points that we would not reveal or use company information, nor company customers information (including the company names etc).

If you ever signed one of these, even just as part of your sign-up agreement, then it will carry as much weight as if it was in your contract.

no, I have never signed anything!