low energy lighbulbs

[UKSBD]

Does anyone know of any low enery lightbulbs that are fully bright as soon
as you switch them on?
I'm on the verge of going round all my house changing back to conventional bulbs :(

[Cornish Steve]

We had this discussion in a previous thread, and you raise an excellent point. Why buy a product that doesn't work the way we want it, green or not?

[ken_uk]

And once the goverment forces everyone to use these new lightbulbs, whats to stop them from introducing new products onto the 'forced' list?

Give it time and we will all have to buy only government approved products, have them installed by government approved staff, tested by government approved staff, and then at the end of the life it would have to be removed by government approved firms, and recylced by government approved firms etc etc etc.

They will probably have government approved inspectors going round checking everyones homes and doing raids to ensure we are complying to....

Each small step, each little freedom taken away, opens the door to more small steps and more freedoms taken away, until one day, there are none left.

[Rhyl Lightworks]

Does anyone know of any low enery lightbulbs that are fully bright as soon
as you switch them on?
I'm on the verge of going round all my house changing back to conventional bulbs :(

Instead of going through all this again, see http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=47360

Barrie

[AdamJ]

And once the goverment forces everyone to use these new lightbulbs, whats to stop them from introducing new products onto the 'forced' list?

Give it time and we will all have to buy only government approved products, have them installed by government approved staff, tested by government approved staff, and then at the end of the life it would have to be removed by government approved firms, and recylced by government approved firms etc etc etc.

They will probably have government approved inspectors going round checking everyones homes and doing raids to ensure we are complying to....

Each small step, each little freedom taken away, opens the door to more small steps and more freedoms taken away, until one day, there are none left.

We're closer than you think already. While my grandparents built their own house following the war as there was nobody available to do it at the time, we're too stupid to be trusted to do anything involving electrics other than put the odd new socket in or change a bulb.

As for government-approved inspectors offering little or no valie, HIP inspectors coming round to count your lightbulbs...

[Dawg]

Interesting comment by someone (http://www.thebusiness.co.uk/trading-floor/409536/mad-hatters.thtml) who works with light bulb manufacturers:

"All of which gives me another chance to trot out my favourite line about these new compact flourescent bulbs. Yes, I know incandescents are going to be banned and yes, I know that it will be claimed as a great example of the sort of forward looking law making we need to deal with climate change. All of which is codswallop. My day job brings me into contact with the lighting industry (no, I don't supply anything for CFLs) and in this past year they made some 1 billion of the CFL bulbs. Because the economics of them are finally right, so people are buying them, stores are ordering them and manufacturers are making them.

The switch over was going to happen whatever politicans did: but that's politics, eh? Spot a bandwagon and climb aboard then claim the credit."

[mattley23]

The low energy bulbs that you can put straight into a standard ceiling rose dont light up fully immediately.

However you can get proper low energy light fitting which take a dedicated low energy bulb which light up fully as soon as you turn it on.

On another note a great question to post on my electrical forum:
http://www.ukdiyforum.co.uk/viewforum.php?f=8

[Rhyl Lightworks]

Interesting comment by someone (http://www.thebusiness.co.uk/trading-floor/409536/mad-hatters.thtml) who works with light bulb manufacturers:

"All of which gives me another chance to trot out my favourite line about these new compact flourescent bulbs. Yes, I know incandescents are going to be banned and yes, I know that it will be claimed as a great example of the sort of forward looking law making we need to deal with climate change. All of which is codswallop. My day job brings me into contact with the lighting industry (no, I don't supply anything for CFLs) and in this past year they made some 1 billion of the CFL bulbs. Because the economics of them are finally right, so people are buying them, stores are ordering them and manufacturers are making them.

The switch over was going to happen whatever politicans did: but that's politics, eh? Spot a bandwagon and climb aboard then claim the credit."

As a retailer of these bulbs, I agree a substantial proportion of the population would buy them anyway, government initiative or not, but it is surprising how many people show complete ignorance about them - some have not even heard of them - and I feel they need a push through government initiatives and education by retailers.
Barrie

[Cornish Steve]

Why? Isn't that marketing's job? Why should tax-payer money be used to market selective goods and bias the market? The more the government tries to control buying behaviour, the more it will hurt the economy. Green products must stand on their own merits or they'll never take off.

[stugster]

The only bulbs in our house that aren't energy saving are the two on our porch lights (the bulbs don't fit inside the housing), and a couple of bedrooms where the lights are Halogen spot bulbs.

I don't care that I have to wait 10 seconds for my room to get to optimum brightness. It's nice that I don't have to continually change the bulbs every 2 months though!

[KM-Tiger]

Why? Isn't that marketing's job? Why should tax-payer money be used to market selective goods and bias the market? The more the government tries to control buying behaviour, the more it will hurt the economy. Green products must stand on their own merits or they'll never take off.

Yes, market forces are a far more powerful tool than regulation can ever be.

As a matter of interest I was just in Homebase and for their sale they are knocking out low energy lamps at 99p each! They are the Sylvania compact fluorescents.

You don't need govt regulation to take advantage of that!

[Rhyl Lightworks]

Yes, market forces are a far more powerful tool than regulation can ever be.

As a matter of interest I was just in Homebase and for their sale they are knocking out low energy lamps at 99p each! They are the Sylvania compact fluorescents.

You don't need govt regulation to take advantage of that!

Government subsidies allow us to sell them at 92p each (Philips and Osram). In an ideal world, market forces would drive the market. I, for one, don't trust big companies to operate for the general good when their own profits are at stake. How many rumours abound about big companies buying up patents of potentially superior competitive products to protect their own inferior, but profit making, products.
Barrie

[Dawg]

Government subsidies allow us to sell them at 92p each (Philips and Osram). In an ideal world, market forces would drive the market. I, for one, don't trust big companies to operate for the general good when their own profits are at stake. How many rumours abound about big companies buying up patents of potentially superior competitive products to protect their own inferior, but profit making, products.
Barrie

“People of the same trade seldom meet together, even for merriment and diversion, but the conversation ends in a conspiracy against the public, or in some contrivance to raise prices.”

Adam Smith.
(Author of "The Wealth of Nations" & "Pimp my Marketforces")

There is never a pure market, but the market forces argument is the least worst I think.

[Subbynet]

I have these bulbs all over my house, and I've never noticed any dimness when they're just switched on.

I always thought this problem was with the older ones when they were new to the market.

[AwayGamesTravel]

All the lights in my house are 60W phillips. They light up to maximum brightness pretty quick. ive never had a problem with it.

sold in John Lewis and Morrissons for less than 50p.

[Rhyl Lightworks]

All the lights in my house are 60W phillips. They light up to maximum brightness pretty quick. ive never had a problem with it.

sold in John Lewis and Morrissons for less than 50p.

Morrisons, presumably John Lewis, and others (including ourselves) have subsidised promotions from time to time, in which the price can be halved, but at present, to the best of my knowledge, the going rate seems to be about £1 (in fact on John Lewis website the cheapest I can find is £3.49.

As for 'market forces' v. 'state interference' I would cite the following examples of where 'market forces' have not produced the most desirable result -
1. The numerous examples of where governments have had to bale out failing companies - the latest example being Northern Rock. Some people would say Northern Rock should have been allowed to go under, but if you had your life savings in them, I think you would appreciate the government help.
2. Going back to the days of Windows 3.1 and AppleMac (and others) many computer experts would say that the best system did not win out.
3. The non availability in the UK of liquid detergents in washing machines, many years after their availabily in other parts of the world.
There are many others, just as there are examples of government interference producing the wrong result. What I am trying to say is that neither market forces nor state intervention produce foolproof results, but many people would say that the UK has got the balance about right.
Barrie