SEO: Most Important Factors

[FunkyBears]

What would all the SEO experts regard as the most important factors when designing a site with SEO in mind, Keywords, headers, file names, links, directory submissions? Could we establish a list so that us lay people could have something to refer too, or pass on to our web developers.
thanks
Paul

[sirearl]

Flying cards spend a year ploughing through that lot

http://www.highrankings.com/

There are loads of good advice sites on the web.

all telling you different thing !!!!!!!

SEO is 99% study and research !!!

[Alex Bellinger]

I'm not an SEO specialist, but I've learned a bit along the way and have subsequently had my basic strategy confirmed as being sound. I'd say the top three without a shadow of a doubt, but in no particular order, are:

1. quality inbound links to your site that are key word relevant;
2. keyword relevant titles for your pages;
3. frequently updated, quality content.

[wood1e2]

I agree with Alex, although I would add "good clean coding" CSS/HTML/W3C compliant. As search bots cannot read through images, so ALT Tags should be used as well.

And you don;t want bots to be stopped by hundreds of extra lines of rubbish code.

This is also for compliance with the laws on blind and deaf viewers.

[PeteYoung]

Taken from SEOMoz website

http://www.seomoz.org/article/search-ranking-factors


Very good article regarding search engine optimisation factors

[Aspect Investments]

The key to good SEO is quality original copy, and quality links from relevant sites.

[sirearl]

The key to good SEO is quality original copy, and quality links from relevant sites.

The key to good SEO is becoming rich enough to turn the bleeding computer off ,and have a life:)

[RedEvo]

I think you'll find that's the result of good SEO.

d

[An Oasis]

There is a down side to your web sites having high ranking in that amongst other factors the number of enquiries and level of spam grows exponentially... So make sure that you only target areas that you are interested in pursuing not a general splatter approach, or you will regret it.

[sirearl]

There is a down side to your web sites having high ranking in that amongst other factors the number of enquiries and level of spam grows exponentially... So make sure that you only target areas that you are interested in pursuing not a general splatter approach, or you will regret it.

well thats a good point I might even consider actualy putting the things were floggin in the title to give the little buggers a clue :rolleyes:

[JustOneUK]

Just to get you started.... (although for what it's worth this is covered in almost every SEO forum)

Domain name
Page URL
Page title
Meta description
H1 tags
Alt tags
good content
keyword density
incoming links
good insite navigation
search engine friendly code

The problem is...most NORMAL people don't know what a good URL is, or what meta description is best, what to put in an alt tag, what terms will bring traffic etc.....
So just get a decent SEO to do it for you.
When I say decent... I mean don't go using someone who posts about their rankings on every single SEO thread (I wonder who I could be refering to.....hmmmmmm :rolleyes: )

[FunkyBears]

Thanks to all those who have replied especially JustoneUk that's exactly what I was looking for.
Anyone want to add to this list?

Domain name
Page URL
Page title
Meta description
H1 tags
Alt tags
good content
keyword density
incoming links
good insite navigation
search engine friendly code

[franglix]

Am I wrong in thinking that title="" descriptors on internal links are also important to feed the Search Engine monsters?

... equally, W3C validation just to check you've matched your code with your DOC-Type declaration?

... and finally the minimum amount of Javascript jumble in the actual page, or if possible placed in a separate .js file.

[sirearl]

Flying cards I have a slightly different list in order of importance to search engines.

1.title
2 meta description
3 content
4 copy keywords
5 incoming links
6 quality of incoming links
7 domain name
8 order of presentation to the seach engine spider
9 h1 and alt tags not so significant as people thing
10 proper internal site linking
11 site map

[sirearl]

Am I wrong in thinking that title="" descriptors on internal links are also important to feed the Search Engine monsters?

... equally, W3C validation just to check you've matched your code with your DOC-Type declaration?

... and finally the minimum amount of Javascript jumble in the actual page, or if possible placed in a separate .js file.

yep your right but, w3c validation is not very important to search engines or 90% of sites would never show up :D

[An Oasis]

Can anyone show me concrete proof that meta data is worth including?

[FunkyBears]

Hi SirEarl,
Thanks for your reply. Do you place any importance whatsover to the Domain and page URL?
Paul
PS Can you please explain the significance of PR. One of my site has a PR3 is that good bad or indifferent?

[sirearl]

Can anyone show me concrete proof that meta data is worth including?


well richard we do "vehicle wrapping" and we are no 2 and it certainly has nothing to do with our URL just look at our meta tags for some of the answer our URL is www.volkspart.co.uk (http://www.volkspart.co.uk)

our result http://www.google.co.uk/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=t&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2006-07,GGLG:en&q=vehicle+wrapping

[franglix]

Maybe this sounds contradictory to Sirearl's results, but believe that meta data - though apparently not a Google priority - is certainly used as an important source of info for Yahoo and the MSN search facilities.

As for the W3C validation Sirearl, I know there are many sites that get up there without being valid, but I do see this as a form of online spellchecker which any pro would be silly to ignore - the validation act can also prompt you to not forget your little details such as the aforementioned 'alt=' descriptors.

The more I play the SEO game, the more I see it's like a game of chess - learning to make the most of all your code pieces.

[FunkyBears]

Can you please explain the significance of PR. One of my site has a PR3 is that good bad or indifferent?
Paul

[sirearl]

Hi SirEarl,
Thanks for your reply. Do you place any importance whatsover to the Domain and page URL?
Paul
PS Can you please explain the significance of PR. One of my site has a PR3 is that good bad or indifferent?

yes I do place importance to domain names but they are not a top priority ,and very often you just can't get really good ones.

But please get as good as you can ,and if you get "ford.com" or "cheapcars.com" please give me a ring :D

Page rank is important especially in the more highly competative areas ,but again is greatly over rated .

A PR of 3 is pretty OK ,it all depends on your competitions power on the web.

A well done SEO site of say PR3 will almost always beat a non SEO site with a PR5.

Then there is another factor that depends ,like life on who you know and not what you know :rolleyes:

[FunkyBears]

thanks SirEarl your words of wisdom have made my day! :) As always feedback is most appreciated
Thanks again
Paul

[sirearl]

thanks SirEarl your words of wisdom have made my day! :) As always feedback is most appreciated
Thanks again
Paul

Thank you Paul.you have just made my wife's day.

I quote her words " wisdom from a man who can't tell the difference between a washing machine and a fridge":( :)

Don't ya just love the little darlings :D

[sirearl]

Maybe this sounds contradictory to Sirearl's results, but believe that meta data - 1 though apparently not a Google priority - is certainly used as an important source of info for Yahoo and the MSN search facilities.

As for the W3C validation Sirearl, I know there are many sites that get up there without being valid, but I do see this as a form of online spellchecker which any pro would be silly to ignore - the validation act can also prompt you to not forget your little details such as the aforementioned 'alt=' descriptors.

The more I play the SEO game, the more I see it's like a 2 game of chess - learning to make the most of all your code pieces.

1.Think again Mon ami :|

2.ite plutôt voler un avion, un peu dangereux si vous ne savez pas où les commandes sont :D

[An Oasis]

well richard we do "vehicle wrapping" and we are no 2 and it certainly has nothing to do with our URL just look at our meta tags for some of the answer our URL is www.volkspart.co.uk (http://www.volkspart.co.uk)

our result http://www.google.co.uk/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=t&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2006-07,GGLG:en&q=vehicle+wrapping

OK and if you loose the meta data for the vehicle wrapping page, does is affect your ranking?

We've experimented and find it makes no difference. Maybe in ultra competitive markets with millions of results but...

[sirearl]

OK and if you loose the meta data for the vehicle wrapping page, does is affect your ranking?

We've experimented and find it makes no difference. Maybe in ultra competitive markets with millions of results but...

well if you look at google's result for "vehicle wrapping" below

http://www.google.co.uk/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=t&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2006-07,GGLG:en&q=vehicle+wrapping


you will see that this site is p5 with a PR4 and we are P2 with a PR2

http://www.pyramidvisuals.co.uk/

now I am not saying that is all due to the meta tags, rather togood meta tags combined with good relevant page copy + the X factor :)

how long did you wait before deciding that your tags made no difference ?

[BeautyScientist]

I find SEO fascinating - a bit like picking a horse for the National. I study the effects of the different combinations, look at the page impressions, the click rates etc. It is all good fun.

I haven't managed to make any money from it yet though.

Again, a bit like picking a horse for the National.

[sirearl]

I find SEO fascinating - a bit like picking a horse for the National. I study the effects of the different combinations, look at the page impressions, the click rates etc. It is all good fun.

I haven't managed to make any money from it yet though.

Again, a bit like picking a horse for the National.

Maybe we could do a swop ,I think I'm in dire need of your services :(

although I would have to charge you rather a lot in order for you to be able to reciprocate :D

[An Oasis]

well if you look at google's result for "vehicle wrapping" below

http://www.google.co.uk/search?sourceid=navclient&aq=t&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLG,GGLG:2006-07,GGLG:en&q=vehicle+wrapping

...

Yah I know all that, what I am seeing with your site on page factor, PR blar blar... all I'm asking is have you experimented, a simple yes or no would suffice.

It's not a bloody difficult question and I have already given my answer - no difference. I hope that if you have read through my threads (over 1200) I try to be helpful and give reasonably researched opinions.

[sirearl]

Yah I know all that, what I am seeing with your site on page factor, PR blar blar... all I'm asking is have you experimented, a simple yes or no would suffice.

It's not a bloody difficult question and I have already given my answer - no difference. I hope that if you have read through my threads (over 1200) I try to be helpful and give reasonably researched opinions.

No I don't experiment thats like asking a brain surgeon the same thing I am an SEO pro

Quote from Jill Whalan the top US SEO

Now that we've covered the all-important title tag and meta description tag, it's time to move on to the very misunderstood and abused meta tag, the meta keyword tag.

and no you ain't reasonable or you have problems with logic and the english language :D

[An Oasis]

Jill Whalan?! Nice lady but finger on the pulse?

Oh well if that's best you can offer, we haven't bothered with MT for 3 years... prove me wrong!!!

[sirearl]

Jill Whalan?! Nice lady but finger on the pulse?

Oh well if that's best you can offer, we haven't bothered with MT for 3 years... prove me wrong!!!

I don't have to prove anything ,Google and all the other search engines are the judges of your SEO endevours as they are of mine and all the other SEO bods in the world :D

[JustOneUK]

As for the W3C validation Sirearl, I know there are many sites that get up there without being valid, but I do see this as a form of online spellchecker which any pro would be silly to ignore
Pro web designer that is (who generally build sites that look nice but don't rank very well). Validation and SEO are currently not connected.

James.

[Aspect Investments]

Quote from Jill Whalan the top US SEO

Now that we've covered the all-important title tag and meta description tag, it's time to move on to the very misunderstood and abused meta tag, the meta keyword tag.


How old is that quote. The meta keyword tag? Hello.

[sirearl]

How old is that quote. The meta keyword tag? Hello.

Oh how did I know you were going to stick your oar in.

yes I know we burried keyword tags along with Henry the eigth .

and the answer to your question is no no no no no no yes,

maybe somtimes or yes or no as the case may be :cool: :cool:

[franglix]

Pro web designer that is (who generally build sites that look nice but don't rank very well). Validation and SEO are currently not connected.
James.
Ok James, I guess I should be careful when I type the word 'pro' - I should be more humble in some of the company who join in here, and perhaps talk with less sweeping enthusiasm about whatever I think I have learned.

I have however been getting some good results by SEO for the few small businesses I have been involved with, and I do get satisfied customers (and paid believe it or not :)). The challenge for someone like myself working in with small business sector is that you are expected to not only design OK, but also 'naturally' get them up in the search engines without the monthly budget backup. It's tough, but I accept and embrace it as the reality of what small business people are expecting within a web site package.

In the context of looking just at the meta KW on my franglix.com home page, I can see how your opinion has been formed about my SEO work. That was written and thrown together c.18 months ago was guesswork and never optimised beyond what you see. It is well overdue and scheduled for a revamp. What you don't see is that (even before I had changed my anchor text on my signature link less than 24 hours ago) I have been targeting similar combinations of those key words. So if you were to venture French + English Web + Design/Services [hopefully your side of the Channel it works also] you would see I rank fine - whether there's many people looking for that phrase is another question for my business and strategy. It is one of several reasons behind why I said metas are 'though apparently not a Google priority' (they and my reference to SEO being like chess - a game of strategy is arguably a reasonable thing to say.

To say something about my results: KW combos I am doing well on (in France for my ongoing client) are 'Climatisation/Climatiseurs + Militaire' - (translated as Military Air-Conditioning) look for the rank of sdeec.fr. Try also 'Hertfordshire + birthday + cakes' and look out for www.cakes2catering.com (http://www.cakes2catering.com). Look at the daily visitor (yellow) stats here (http://www.airjobs.eu.com/stats/) of another site I SEO kick-started last year from negligible qualified visitors to a ongoing web business reality (my services no longer required). I am not going to bore people further with other detail, but I hope I have reasonably defended my little corner... sure I am coming from a Jack-of-all-trades stand point but I think I have something to contribute on this thread. A small web-reliant business is not going to suffer in my hands.

Anyway James, I thank you for the compliment :D about my 'nice' design.

[JustOneUK]

Sorry franglix if my comments came across harsh, it wasn't meant that way and it wasn't a comment about you or your site.
I didn't look at your site so I have no idea what it looks like and certainly didn't therefore notice any SEO done on your site. I didn't even notice you had it in your sig. (but now I will pay you a visit of course :D )

My comment was purely based on the principal that web designers should worry about validating code (if they want to be taken seriously by other web designers) and SEO's need to worry about getting sites to the top of search engines. There isn't (yet) any proven correllation between the two. Frankly I couldn't care if my site validates or not as long as it sits OK in the SERP's.

To be honest I haven't even bothered to SEO most of my own sites and a lot of pages are hanging around in supplemental results (it's enough just to do the homepage) but I make a living so I am not worried about it. :cool:

The reason for this is the market was WAYYYYYYYYYY too competitive for me when I started.
You say for example 'Hertfordshire + birthday + cakes' where there are only 66,000 results, whereas I am having to go for stupidly impossible terms like free advertising (http://www.justoneuk.com) of which there are 333,000,000 results on Google.com (I am currently 12th on Google.com and 2nd on Google.co.uk, dropped to a pathetic 15th on Yahoo.com and 2nd on Yahoo.co.uk from 386,000,000) I wish I could target those lesser phrases, but I guess I made my bed.....

With my results for this term alone (there are a lot more) I think it makes me pretty reasonable at SEO?

edit>

Ok, I looked at your site :) it appears it's in a foreign language.... so it's not much use to me, nor me to it. hehe.

[franglix]

[Off-Topic]
As for...
1.Think again Mon ami :|

2.ite plutôt voler un avion, un peu dangereux si vous ne savez pas où les commandes sont :D

Your manner of speaking and correcting others is almost soothing. However please spare us the spectacle of your intoxication with yourself, and your fascination with your font size. Equally, if you really think you can start patronising someone in another language, ensure that you write it correctly, otherwise strangely enough, people may react in a very offended manner. Best to practice first with your own.

At the top of your tree, you seem to have a surprising amount of time on your on your hands (430 posts in such a short time-frame). Perhaps it is a measure how effective you are, or perhaps you are not actually earning a crust out of it. Either way as you seem such an authority here, I am really looking forward to you dedicating more on-topic time to offer us the benefit of supporting evidence from the multitude of web projects that you have been clearly working on. My experience of someone who talks with such certainty, is that you must have worked on and directed at least 10-15 SEO'd web projects (not pages). I hope I am not underestimating the numbers. I do hope you will share them with us. I have gone 'all in', so it's your turn to show what hand you are really playing with.

[/Off-Topic]

[JustOneUK]

(430 posts in such a short time-frame).
I think you have isolated a forté :)
Although, all the best to him. We each have our strengths and weaknesses.






(Man!, that's a lot of posts for 1 month!)

[sirearl]

[Off-Topic]
As for...


Your manner of speaking and correcting others is almost soothing. However please spare us the spectacle of your intoxication with yourself, and your fascination with your font size. Equally, if you really think you can start patronising someone in another language, ensure that you write it correctly, otherwise strangely enough, people may react in a very offended manner. Best to practice first with your own.

At the top of your tree, you seem to have a surprising amount of time on your on your hands (430 posts in such a short time-frame). Perhaps it is a measure how effective you are, or perhaps you are not actually earning a crust out of it. Either way as you seem such an authority here, I am really looking forward to you dedicating more on-topic time to offer us the benefit of supporting evidence from the multitude of web projects that you have been clearly working on. My experience of someone who talks with such certainty, is that you must have worked on and directed at least 10-15 SEO'd web projects (not pages). I hope I am not underestimating the numbers. I do hope you will share them with us. I have gone 'all in', so it's your turn to show what hand you are really playing with.

[/Off-Topic]

Bloody google translation :mad:

should have known better ,last time I used it I asked a guy in spain for a music CD and he sent me a packet of condoms :rolleyes:

should have read "If your going to fly a plane its a good idea to know where the controls are and don't play chess during take off "

And yes I am a patronising old git :redface:

and no I have never mastered my own language because its spelt wrong :rolleyes:

and yes I have loads of time on my hands because no one will give me any work :mad:

and as for earning a crust I am just of to the local bakers to see if they are throwing out any stale rolls !!

As for showing my hand I must admit to a certain amount of embarrassment.

but oh well I don't want to be called a cowardly English Pom

http://www.whitstablescene.co.uk/books.htm

[BeautyScientist]

I have been dabbling in SEO for my own page with almost no success at all. I read this thread to see if I could learn something. I am afraid I was lost almost straight away, I haven't got the lingo yet.

It is quite interesting that what I would have thought would be a straight forward technical subject turns out to be full of controversy and passion.

[sirearl]

I have been dabbling in SEO for my own page with almost no success at all. I read this thread to see if I could learn something. I am afraid I was lost almost straight away, I haven't got the lingo yet.

It is quite interesting that what I would have thought would be a straight forward technical subject turns out to be full of controversy and passion.


yep well that just proves that none of us know what we are doing :rolleyes:

I mean you don't see heart sugeons arguing over the best way to do a By-pass.:(

By its very nature it is a highly competative area as we are all trying to be No 1.

I have suggested to the olympic commitee that it be entered as an event but they have refused on the grounds that it is riddled with unsporting activities:eek:

[I, Brian]

Can anyone show me concrete proof that meta data is worth including?

Your meta description serves two key purposes:

1. Using unique meta-descriptions on each page helps suggest to Google that pages are duplicate. I've seen a lot of instances recently where lack of unique meta descriptions can send pages into the supplemental index.

2. Perhaps more importantly, though, your meta-description is your sales copy. Check your rankings - what does the associated text with your site listing say? If it doesn't invite a clickthrough, you're not making the most of your position.

2c.

[Tin]

Your meta description serves two key purposes:

1. Using unique meta-descriptions on each page helps suggest to Google that pages are duplicate.

Oops, you must have too much work on Brian, your typo I presume meant to say "helps suggest to Google that pages are individual/unique." or words to that effect.:) That being the case then I completely agree with you.

[JustOneUK]

It is quite interesting that what I would have thought would be a straight forward technical subject turns out to be full of controversy and passion.
We are all Latino Flamenco dancers :D

[sirearl]

We are all Latino Flamenco dancers :D


Spot on :D :D

[FunkyBears]

It's good to know that there are so many of you that are so passionate about
SEO!
another one to add to list;
Try to use different meta descriptions on each page this will help to suggest to Google that each page is unique.
keep them comming
thanks again
Paul

[sirearl]

It's good to know that there are so many of you that are so passionate about
SEO!
another one to add to list;
Try to use different meta descriptions on each page this will help to suggest to Google that each page is unique.
keep them comming
thanks again
Paul

don't try just bleeding do it:rolleyes:

[franglix]

James (a.k.a. JustOneOK). Yes it would help that I get the English version of my site online, absolutely. Currently I am relying a liitle too much on word of mouth marketing :)

Anyway your comments were not harsh. I like everyone, need to be reminded to offer explanations/evidence for any debatable opinions - even if we were just asked to help list-build. To be positive, I have just posted a thread (http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=35826) in respect of your issue with (design and SEO) specialists touching on other people's domains, so I hope that will extract that part of the passion to another place.

You did raise a good issue about choosing your KW battles carefully, so that the competition is not unsurmountable. For example with the Hertfordshire cake decorator (http://www.cakes2catering.com) site - as it is a local business - it made more sense to geo-localise it in the metas and copy using the person's postcode. The site author has equally been educated about the need (and their ability) to get the backlinks campaign under way; that in fact they can make a real difference. Right now, it is getting 50 unique visitors a day (which for a small part-time business is a result). As part of my ongoing work, I freely add any links they need to offer in exchange.

I have to come away from the computer for a week, so I look forward to the debate continuing in my absence.

[UKSBD]

It's good to know that there are so many of you that are so passionate about
SEO!
another one to add to list;
Try to use different meta descriptions on each page this will help to suggest to Google that each page is unique.
keep them comming
thanks again
Paul


Add this to your list

meta name="ICBM" content=
meta name="DC.title" content=

and geour

[FunkyBears]

meta name="ICBM" content=
meta name="DC.title" content=

and geour

Can you explain the significance of this?
Appologies for my ignorance
Paul

[UKSBD]

I'll give you a clue ;o)
http://geourl.org/near?p=http://www.uksmallbusinessdirectory.co.uk/Counties/oxfordshire.html

[ibscom]

If it helps anyone I found this seo tutorial very easy to follow and it explains exactly why you need to do what it is telling you.

http://www.seo-guy.com/tutorial.html

[sirearl]

If it helps anyone I found this seo tutorial very easy to follow and it explains exactly why you need to do what it is telling you.

http://www.seo-guy.com/tutorial.html

only an american could have a site called "SEO guy" I could not find any of his SE results he claimed to have?

[I, Brian]

Morgan used to have top rankings for SEO-related keywords, but got burned in Google for playing with fire. So far as I know, his specialist area is SEO for real estate companies.

[UKSBD]

I think he has had the google screws loosened within the past month.

[UKSBD]

just to add, seo-inc also appear to have had the heat switched down too

[I, Brian]

Oops, you must have too much work on Brian, your typo I presume meant to say "helps suggest to Google that pages are individual/unique." or words to that effect.:) That being the case then I completely agree with you.


Sorry, missed this - quite right. :)

[scope]

The most important thing about SEO is that you are better than your nearest competitor. Forget blindly fiddling with your meta data all day if it is already better than everyone elses.

Though some members here (astonishingly) claim not to look at competitors (i'm afraid you have to in any business), it is the most important aspect of SEO. You may find that you have very little to do to be number one.

for more information visit www.webobjective.net

[postpack]

How come you lot can post urls and I can't post this http:www.postpack.co.uk - also how come I can't put a url in my signature - have I got to be a registered user for a period of time or post so many replies or something - Anyway SEO advice - Content - links - patience - in that order!!
:D

[postpack]

hey it worked but what about the signature - any advice anyone?

[FunkyBears]

http://www.seofaststart.com/
Thanks everyone for all your feedback. I found this report informative.
Your comments please
Paul

[_Chris_]

I haven't read the whole thread - just the first two pages and didn't see it mentioned.

What about the links on pages. I've read it's good practice to have a sentence with a link that says:

Click here to view our top 10 Jazz CD's

Rather than:

Click here to view our top 10 Jazz CD's

In other words, don't link the "click here" text..

Chris :)