Whatever shall I do about Patents...

[Scott-CopyandDesign]

Right well to start off I'm 16 and I have a good idea for a product to manufacture and sell. I've done all the required market research up to this point and there seems to be a good market for it. I've also asked opinions from very trustworthy people in Business and they have told me it has potential. So as many successful Businessmen and women keep advising, I'm just going to go for it and not stop.

The problem is I've hit a milestone before I can even begin. I need a Patent to really do anything and being 16 I can't afford the minimum £2000+ for a UK Patent or qualified Agent.

Now I've heard many stories from various people about the devious world of business and how many companies even have departments just for the purpose of stealing ideas and working around Patents. I was thinking about going straight to a VC but with no good research or proven profitability (because I can't sell the product incase someone else takes the idea) I don't think I'd have much luck. I thought about approaching a VC just to cover the Patent costs before going further but trust becomes an issue again.

So basically in a nutshell, I don't have the money to pay for a Patent myself. I can't approach anyone for money because of the trust issue and the unlikely-ness of getting any interest because I can't even make and sell any of the Products myself to prove it will sell with lack of idea protection. And I'm just stuck.

Anyone have any ideas?

PS: Sorry if my little speech is a little incoherent, it's 2:20am and I'm tired.

[profitxchange]

Sorry to be a downer but you are stuck on the patent route. Why do you need to patent it anyway? you would not have the funds to defend a case of violation anyway.
Why not not just go for it fast and get into the market and risk it. you might just make a lot of money before anyone catches up. then invent something else. Do not be obsessed with protection be obsessed with exploiting the idea for money!

[Scott-CopyandDesign]

Sorry to be a downer but you are stuck on the patent route. Why do you need to patent it anyway? you would not have the funds to defend a case of violation anyway.
Why not not just go for it fast and get into the market and risk it. you might just make a lot of money before anyone catches up. then invent something else. Do not be obsessed with protection be obsessed with exploiting the idea for money!

Well I might be wrong but as far as I understood I could not Patent the product when it's in the public domain, I might be wrong. What I'm more concerned about is someone Patenting my idea then using it against me to stop me producing it. Then again both of those concepts rules contradict eachother so I'm not sure.

My main concern is that it's in the Fragrance market (an indirect competitor of bottled fragrances) and it's just the type of product any fragrance manufacturer would produce as a new product and form a market around it. I would have to be neotiating with these companies for usage rights so I'm basically giving them a Pitch on an unprotected idea in the process if I don't get it protected. Thats my theory anyway.

[creospace]

Sory I missread the thread I thought it said:

Whatever shall I do about Parents...

[DuaneJackson]

I may be wrong - but once the idea is in the public domain, or is "pre-existing" then another company can't patent it.

To some degree I agree with profitxchange. If you can't get the money together to patent it, what are your options? Give up or go for it - I'd choose go for it.

You can still get an investor at this stage - but they'd be taken a bigger risk (As it's unproven) and hence would want more equity for less money.

"I'm just going to go for it and not stop."

Bad advice. Don't blindly plough forward. Be prepared at any stage to accept that the idea isn't going to work and you need to pull the plug. I see too many people pursing an idea becuase they've invested so much time and money and emotional attachment in it that they refuse to accept the reality. A typical case is on Dragons Den when someone is told by 5 dragons that their idea is sh*te, and intheir exit interview they say the idea will work "because it has to".

Good luck with it. I don't want to sound patronising, but it's great that someone of your age is being so enterprising. If there's ever anything I can do, do get in touch.

d

[Scott-CopyandDesign]

I may be wrong - but once the idea is in the public domain, or is "pre-existing" then another company can't patent it.

To some degree I agree with profitxchange. If you can't get the money together to patent it, what are your options? Give up or go for it - I'd choose go for it.

You can still get an investor at this stage - but they'd be taken a bigger risk (As it's unproven) and hence would want more equity for less money.

"I'm just going to go for it and not stop."

Bad advice. Don't blindly plough forward. Be prepared at any stage to accept that the idea isn't going to work and you need to pull the plug. I see too many people pursing an idea becuase they've invested so much time and money and emotional attachment in it that they refuse to accept the reality. A typical case is on Dragons Den when someone is told by 5 dragons that their idea is sh*te, and intheir exit interview they say the idea will work "because it has to".

Good luck with it. I don't want to sound patronising, but it's great that someone of your age is being so enterprising. If there's ever anything I can do, do get in touch.

d

Oh I'm fully aware now of the realistic values when going into something like this, I've learnt from other experiences. What I mean is I've seen many people just sit and ponder over an idea for years and end up never doing anything. Now I'm at the age of having my own Legal identity in terms of business so I'm going to do things properly now, but I understand your point. I'm also taking A-level Business and Accounting so that should really help out.

I know what you mean about Dragons den too, some people are so blind. It's actually that program which has made me decide to produce a small amount of the Products and sell them personally so I can get feedback and see if it is actually profitable and I'm not just being blinded by my own want of achievement.

There is one other option. I can apply for a secondary patent, it's about £70. It doesn’t offer any legal protection but it can stop people from registering the Patent for themselves. I believe once I register it I have a year to apply for the full Patent before it becomes available to the public again. It could also turn out to be a good deterrent.

Anyone have any opinions?

[PlainText]

Talking of Dragons' Den, I'm reminded of the guy with the coffee table cum computer, who was willing to put his house on the market, despite having a wife and child and being told his idea had been tried previously and flopped.

Reakt, I would at least for now file the secondary patent as it will buy you some time to find a backer or test the idea, for very little outlay.

[DuaneJackson]

For a secondary patent isn't it still very important to get the applications wording correct so that the patent can't be easily worked around? If so, you'll be looking at a good few hundred on top in professional fees.

[Scott-CopyandDesign]

It seems like the only viable option unless I can find a kind hearted Investor who would want to fund the Patent before testing it out and then looking into further investing, but the chances of that are pretty slim.

Even grants are out of my reach, the Prince's trust only works with people 18+. Seems like no one caters for the young individuals these days.

[DuaneJackson]

Freinds, Family and Fools? Have you worked out exactly how much you would need to get the idea of the ground?

[Scott-CopyandDesign]

Freinds, Family and Fools? Have you worked out exactly how much you would need to get the idea of the ground?

I'm still working though making a Business plan. There's been a few setbacks though since I have to be careful who and what I approach to do research and find other information. I suppose I could start using Confidentiality agreements.

I could quite easily begin manufacturing and trading with £160,000+ of Capital but with my age and lack of track record in anything that's more then likely an impossibility. So a more realistic alternative will probably be to seek out small funds £5,000-£10,000 in the coming years and start from the bottom working my way up. Putting profit back into the Business to keep growing. In theory I could even do it with next to nothing (I'd need a sowing machine) but it would take much, much longer and take quite a few years before it reached a professional status.