Accountancy query

[tony84]

Hi,

I have set up a ltd company. I already have an accountant.

However im just curious, we didnt shop around we just used our existing accountants. Im not looking for one - not at the minute anyway.

What should i be expecting to pay per month?
My accountant has said he will send a spreadsheet over for me to update and send over to them as and when but to us that seems if were doing that, what are we paying our accountants for?

Just wondering if any of you accountants could clarify whether this is correct and what is a reasonable amount to pay.

Cheers

[Williams lester]

The answer is......it depends, a lot will hinge on what they are actually doing for you, do they provide tax planning and associated services as well as completing your bookkeeping, accounts, VAT, PAYE etc etc.

[truesilver]

I'm not an accountant, but from my experience a bookkeeper would enter your transactions / expenses etc into a spreadsheet and the accountant is the one who puts everything in the right boxes, files your tax return AND should save you tax by knowing your business and advising you on what you should and shouldn't be claiming.

The very small accountants I know will charge approx £300 for the year / tax return though you can be charged up to £1000 for the year.

Bigger companies obviously charge more.

The main thing I would recommend is if you do change, don't just go for the cheapest. My accountant saves my clients approximately £1000 per year in tax by knowing his stuff and NOT trying to find loopholes in the tax system!

Hope that helps.

L

[MyAccountantOnline]

Hi,

I have set up a ltd company. I already have an accountant.

However im just curious, we didnt shop around we just used our existing accountants. Im not looking for one - not at the minute anyway.

What should i be expecting to pay per month?
My accountant has said he will send a spreadsheet over for me to update and send over to them as and when but to us that seems if were doing that, what are we paying our accountants for?

Just wondering if any of you accountants could clarify whether this is correct and what is a reasonable amount to pay.

Cheers

You will see a huge difference in accountants fees, in how they operate and what is included.

[MyAccountantOnline]

I'm not an accountant, but from my experience a bookkeeper would enter your transactions / expenses etc into a spreadsheet and the accountant is the one who puts everything in the right boxes, files your tax return AND should save you tax by knowing your business and advising you on what you should and shouldn't be claiming.
L

Yes traditionally they do - but we dont all work in this way;):)

[tony84]

We had a meeting and they discussed ways on saving money on tax. But it would appear we would have to fill in the spreadsheet.

Thanks for te feedback, ill see what they say.

[elainec100@cheapaccounting]

Hi,

I have set up a ltd company. I already have an accountant.

However im just curious, we didnt shop around we just used our existing accountants. Im not looking for one - not at the minute anyway.

What should i be expecting to pay per month?
My accountant has said he will send a spreadsheet over for me to update and send over to them as and when but to us that seems if were doing that, what are we paying our accountants for?

Just wondering if any of you accountants could clarify whether this is correct and what is a reasonable amount to pay.

Cheers
would it not be better to enter the data onto an on line system that gives you on going accounts so you can check your position, plus estimate of tax to pay etc (like ours does :))

[elainec100@cheapaccounting]

Getting the most from your accountant:

http://www.cheapaccounting.co.uk/blog/?p=573

Small businesses often feel they don’t get value from their accountancy fees, but it is a two way street. All too often these businesses:
• don’t keep their records properly, and don’t respond to requests for information,
• have to be chased to meet deadlines and insist work is done at the last minute
• don’t pay their bills on time
• don’t listen or respond to the advice that is given
Too often, small businesses are paying professional hourly rates simply for someone to file their paperwork or make a list of transactions.
The biggest thing the average small business can do to reduce their accountancy fee is to do the bookkeeping yourself – if you do it, you don’t have to pay your accountant significant amounts of money to do it for you.
Be aware of the deadlines that apply to you and let your accountant have your paperwork within 2 to 3 months of your year end.
Leaving things to the last minute may be natural, but it will certainly mean that you pay more and leaves no room for an unexpected delay or to deal with issues arising from the work done.
It also means that such things as tax planning can’t be done properly, and the need for advice cannot properly be addressed.
The truth is that most deadlines are generous enough to give sufficient time to complete everything, and your accountant won’t be impressed if you turn up on Christmas Eve with your records to sort out and your tax return to do.
You might believe the accountant has a month to complete the work, but the accountant will be focusing on the Christmas break and all those clients in the queue before you. He will also wonder where you have been since last April?!
What information does your accountant need?
Make sure you know what your accountant needs from you, so he doesn’t have to keep asking for missing information.
Ask your accountant for a list of what is needed.
As a guide in addition to your bookkeeping records you should also provide:
• all bank statements for all bank accounts filed in order
• details of new business loans;
• HP agreements;
• vehicle purchases and part exchange information,
• business credit card statements,
• interest on savings,
• confirmation of pension contributions
Make sure you understand what is included in the fee your accountant has quoted, and what isn’t.
How much tax planning is done, and what about a review of PAYE and VAT?
Money laundering
You also need to understand your accountants Money Laundering obligations.
The definition is very wide and includes tax evasion. All professional advisers have a legal duty to report suspected money laundering offences. In the context of accounts and tax, this could include:
• Not declaring all takings or sources of income
• Passing off personal expenses as business
• Failing to correct known VAT errors
• Having unusual, undocumented, unexplained and significant cash deposits and withdrawals
Advice
If you need advice on a complex area, make sure your accountant is aware of all the circumstances and consider asking for such advice in writing. It will reduce the risks of misunderstanding, but expect to pay a fee for it.
How much should I pay?
It is not possible to generalise about how much you should pay your accountant. It depends on your own circumstances. As a guide, a small sole trader with good bookkeeping should be able to find online Qualified Accountants from £19.99 a month or for a limited company from £29.99 a month.
That would be us!!

[kjmcculloch]

The biggest thing the average small business can do to reduce their accountancy fee is to do the bookkeeping yourself – if you do it, you don’t have to pay your accountant significant amounts of money to do it for you.


Although I can see what Elaine is getting at with this comment, I don't necessarily agree with all of it. She is exactly right when she says you don't want to be paying accountant rates for bookkeeping, but to say do it yourself is not the answer for the majority of small business owners. Too many people struggle doing their own bookkeeping, meaning something which could take a qualified and competent bookkeeper an hour to do can take a business owner 3 or more hours.

To waste 3 times the time doing this is fine if your time is free, but most of us don't get free time. Time always costs. This time can be better spent growing your business, or sell your product or services. The way I try to get this across is to work out how much you earn on average per hour, multiply this by the number of hours you spend doing your accounts. This is the true cost of the cheap 'do it yourself' option. You will probably find a competent bookkeeper a far cheaper option.

The other easy trap to fall into is doing all your bookkeeping yourself, taking it along to your accountant at the end of the year only to find you've done it wrong, and we all know that it usually costs more to fix something than to do it right first time.

The message, don't scrimp on bookkeeping. Place the same importance on this as you do on your end of year returns.

[tony84]

if im being honest, im actualy thinking more that im paying quite a lot and having to do a what seems to be a lot of the work myself.

[MyAccountantOnline]

you don't want to be paying accountant rates for bookkeeping,

That depends on the accountant:)

In my practice we primarily provide an all in one combined service for our clients - we look after everything bookkeeping, VAT, payroll, year end accounts and tax returns.

If you look at the fixed fees we charge you will see we are considerably cheaper than many of our competitors, and provide, in my opinion, a much better, more proactive service than many accountants. As we are looking after our clients affairs on a monthly basis we can spot tax saving oppurtunities etc for them on a month by month basis.

[kjmcculloch]

You are right, of course, Nicola. And your rates do seem good and of course you are doing the bookkeeping too. However I think you rather missed my point, which was that doing your own bookkeeping to save a bit of cash can work for some, but their are many who try and it becomes the beginning of a downward spiral for them. You must have seen some of the same attempts at DIY bookkeeping that I have.

[tony84]

Nicola your prices are atleast a third less (including the pay roll £10 per month) that we are being quoted.

There isnt an issue with paying but we dont want to pay and do some spreadsheet, we just dont want to do the spreadsheet and waste time on that - as our time will be much better spent promoting the business.

I will see what they say.

[MyAccountantOnline]

You are right, of course, Nicola. And your rates do seem good and of course you are doing the bookkeeping too. However I think you rather missed my point, which was that doing your own bookkeeping to save a bit of cash can work for some, but their are many who try and it becomes the beginning of a downward spiral for them. You must have seen some of the same attempts at DIY bookkeeping that I have.

No I take your point entirely - we dont disagree.

The service we provide doesnt work for all.

And yes I have seen some horrendous attempts at bookkeeping no doubt like you - it was actually that which was one of the driving factors behind me setting up My Accountant Online, prior to that I had operated very traditional style accountancy practices.

[MyAccountantOnline]

Nicola your prices are atleast a third less (including the pay roll £10 per month) that we are being quoted.

There isnt an issue with paying but we dont want to pay and do some spreadsheet, we just dont want to do the spreadsheet and waste time on that - as our time will be much better spent promoting the business.

I will see what they say.

Thank you Tony - if you have any questions please feel free to email me direct, I'm always happy to help:)