Keyword Research: determining profit potential/acceptable level of competition

[Lestrange]

Hello everyone.

So, I've recently been doing a lot of keyword research on various topics, trying to determine which one to get going with. Bearing in mind I am new to this, highly competitive keywords are a no-go area for me, since I just don't have the experience or money to compete at that level (no PPC campaigns for me :redface:). But the competitive ones are likely to yield at least some profits even if it is not much. So there's a bit of an impasse.

What is an acceptable level of competition?
What do any of you guys find is the best way of determining if keywords have potential?
And, what sort of criteria for keywords (monthly searches, competition, etc) would you suggest is a good starting level?

Cheers. :)

[joshchandler]

Let's start at the basics. What are your interests, which type of niche would you be able to write the most content about with ease?

There's no point in targeting "Mortgages" (as an example) as a website because the competition is far too intense.

Instead, if you targeted a sub-niche of that term such as "Mortgage Interest Rates" then you have far less competition and plenty of people searching for that term (according to data collected from Google Adwords Keyword Tool!)

It's certainly possible to create a content site about "Mortgages", but in today's information world you have to target what is referred to as the "Long Tail", those terms which are related to the niche but generate less traffic.

By using these small boosts, you can gradually build up a credible brand within a competitive industry.

It's simply not enough any more to just write a general overview of a topic. You really have to meet the needs of a few to boost your main content higher up the search engine rankings.

[SEO Traffic Solutions]

If you are a complete whet-behind-the-ears newbie then I would suggest you find a keyword in Google's keyword tool that gets at least 50 broad searches per month. Go to Google and put that keyword in quotes("). If it has < 50,000 competing pages then go for it.

With some keyword rich content and some consistent, well placed one-way backlinks you should be on the first page in a couple weeks to a month.

Analysing the strength of competition should not be ignored, and I could write a whole book just on this topic. But for a quick and dirty guide; add up all the page ranks of the 10 sites currently on the first page. If the average is 3 or less then go for it.

[sirearl]

Finding the right product is far more important than keyword research e.t.c..

Earl

[SEO Traffic Solutions]

I agree, having a good product that converts is also very important but it all starts with a keyword.

[sirearl]

I agree, having a good product that converts is also very important but it all starts with a keyword.

Disagree I would say any successfull business starts with the right product.

Quantity of sales does not necessarily mean profit.;)

Earl

[SEO Traffic Solutions]

But if you have a site that gets lots of traffic (due to a good choice of keywords) but you have a lousy product that doesn't sell, you can always change the product to one that does sell.
But what good is having a great product that no one can find because you've chosen the wrong keywords?

[Parkwood IM]

Looking at the number of competing pages is just guessing and I recommend you don't use that as a method for analysing competition

Using the allintitle sytax in Google would be a better idea but still not enough to make a decision on.

I would recommend downloading the Market Samurai software (you can get a free trial) and watching their free training videos.

This will teach you how to use the software, but more importantly, how to properly analyse competition

Market research is the most important aspect of SEO so you want to make sure you get it right.

And on the topic of product or market first, I would say it always has to be market first (keyword).

Cheers

Jon

[terryuk]

I'd agree and say product is more important.. although I do get ideas that stem from key phrases which gain my interest.

The product may be the keyword... so it can work both ways.

[paretowasright]

Hello everyone.

So, I've recently been doing a lot of keyword research on various topics, trying to determine which one to get going with. Bearing in mind I am new to this, highly competitive keywords are a no-go area for me, since I just don't have the experience or money to compete at that level (no PPC campaigns for me :redface:). But the competitive ones are likely to yield at least some profits even if it is not much. So there's a bit of an impasse.

What is an acceptable level of competition?
What do any of you guys find is the best way of determining if keywords have potential?
And, what sort of criteria for keywords (monthly searches, competition, etc) would you suggest is a good starting level?

Cheers. :)

I use this rough benchmark but interested to see what others use for their criteria:

Ideally at least 50 phrase searches per day, maximum 30,000 page description competition and max 10,000 title competition. Click through rate above 1.5% and OCI (commercial intention) above 80%.

I will also look at page 1 Google results and assess the PR, back links etc of each of the top 10 to see how easy/difficult it would be to topple them.

[Parkwood IM]

Ideally at least 50 phrase searches per day, maximum 30,000 page description competition and max 10,000 title competition. Click through rate above 1.5% and OCI (commercial intention) above 80%.

I will also look at page 1 Google results and assess the PR, back links etc of each of the top 10 to see how easy/difficult it would be to topple them.

There was a time when you could use the number of competing pages to judge how easy it is to rank but that's not the case any more.

There could be a phrase with 1,000,000 competing pages and no significant competition, and similarly, a phrase with 1,000 competing pages and very high quality sites occupying the top 10 positions.

Therefore, you can use competing pages etc as an indicato but you must always analyse the top 10 results if a first page listing is what you're after.

I really like the idea behind the OCI tool, but I can't help but find some of the results a bit strange so I always take them with a pinch of salt.

In my experience, using the average Cost Per Click from AdWords can be a good indicator for how much commercial potential a search phrase has.

Cheers

Jon :)

[paretowasright]

There was a time when you could use the number of competing pages to judge how easy it is to rank but that's not the case any more.

There could be a phrase with 1,000,000 competing pages and no significant competition, and similarly, a phrase with 1,000 competing pages and very high quality sites occupying the top 10 positions.

Therefore, you can use competing pages etc as an indicato but you must always analyse the top 10 results if a first page listing is what you're after.

I really like the idea behind the OCI tool, but I can't help but find some of the results a bit strange so I always take them with a pinch of salt.

In my experience, using the average Cost Per Click from AdWords can be a good indicator for how much commercial potential a search phrase has.

Cheers

Jon :)

Jon, you are repeating what I have already said about analysing the top 10 results and making it sound like your own work....it reminds me of the Americans coming into WW2 at the end and taking all the glory ;)
I agree about OCI being wobbly and yes adwords competition and cost per click are other good indicators.

[Parkwood IM]

You're wrong... The difference is in the detail

You talk about competing pages as part of your criteria and I talk about it as part of the process.

[sirearl]

I will explain why the product is of paramont importance for me.

You may well get a No1 for a keyword that has Millions of results in the SERP's

But if you are selling a product where the profit per sale is measured in 10's of pounds you are going to have to do a hell of a lot more work that if you were selling a product with maybe only a few hundred thousand in the SERP's that also makes you a few thousand per sale.

Profit is effort related any fool should be able to earn a good screw if they work 120 hours a week.;)

Earl

[Parkwood IM]

I will explain why the product is of paramont importance for me.I totally agree with your post but I would personally consider that process to be part of determining a keyword's commercial potential

[paretowasright]

You're wrong... The difference is in the detail

You talk about competing pages as part of your criteria and I talk about it as part of the process.

Jon, I was just trying to help the original poster with some broad guidelines which was what they asked for. I will leave you to it as you are very clearly trying to establish yourself on here. I just a market samurai user of 3 years.

[Parkwood IM]

I'm just trying to help too

I didn't mean your opinion was wrong - Everyone has a different approach to keyword research

What I meant was that I don't agree with your suggestion that I was just regurgitating what you had said previously and not adding any value to the discussion

[paretowasright]

I'm just trying to help too

I didn't mean your opinion was wrong - Everyone has a different approach to keyword research

What I meant was that I don't agree with your suggestion that I was just regurgitating what you had said previously and not adding any value to the discussion

No worries Jon, I am actually pleased another MS user is around and look forward to future discussions.