Old Address

[Astaroth]

Anyone have any idea how I can find out the date I moved out of a property?

Over the last few years I have been moving around a lot, initially being a student and then with climbing the corporate ladder.

Dundee council has written to my name at one of my relatives address stating that I owe money for the period of 2001-2002.

Having throught about things I believe that I left the property they are talking about some time in 2001 but for the duration of the period of living there I was a full time student - as was the other person living at the address with me.

Unfortunately I only keep my records for 3 years and so dont have anything go back that far to check up on.... I have only just received the letter (as it was sent to my Aunt who sent it to my mother but my mother has been on holiday until yesterday) but it said I must contact them by 13th Friday.

I have tried the credit reference agencies but 2 of them state they send your password out within a week and the 3rd does give instant access but the random questions asked about a loan (which I didnt have a clue about).

Any other (legitimate) way of getting my old addresses quickly? I dont believe either myself nor my friend registered for voting as we both were still registered at home addresses.

Many thanks

[creacom]

If this property was rented then I would call the landlord. He will be able to tell you.

Jacqui

[Astaroth]

It was a rented property but I have disposed of the contract both of the flat the council are questioning and also the one I moved into next as it was so long ago.

No longer have contact details for any of the people I lived with either but I have contacted previous mutual friends to see if they have any contact details for them... no response yet.

[creacom]

Well try and find the telephone number for the flat that you used to live in and call there and ask for the landlords number. Or if you know anyone who lives near by then send them or send a letter.

Jacqui

[Astaroth]

I dont know how to search for the number of a property rather than the occupent.

I know I am over reacting to their threats on the "call us by 13 Jan" but I currently dont want to have to go down the route of writting and having to wait a week or two to see if they happen to respond (esp as I believe the landlord put it on the market after we left - but I have no idea if he actually sold it or not)

[creacom]

Well the best thing to do is call the council first thing tomorrow morning and explain. There is a solution to everything. Before finding the evidence to back up your claim its better to get in touch with them and show that you are willing to sort out the problem. Then take it for there.

Good luck

Jacqui

[Astaroth]

Thanks - I know I was a student at the time so would have been exempt anyway - plus they are only charging £53 in council tax when I was at that address for approximately a year and hadnt paid anything in the previous year etiher (due to being exempt) but I know with these things you need to make sure everything is in order. And it seemingly has already gone to court so they have found be liable for the tax plus a further £155 fee.... guess I really need to speak to them before I continue over reacting

[bwglaw]

I have come across this a few times and how I get round it is simple. I ask the 'creditor' to provide documentation to show the debtor is actually liable for the debt. That is, ask the Council to provide documentation to show you are liable for the debt - they would need to have some evidence that you occupied that address and you are liable for the debt.

I have written to creditors for clients and put this to them. My clients never hear a whisper. They know that if they wish to take further legal action against you they have to disclose the documents anyway. If they refuse, then you have a good argument that the creditor is acting unreasonable and judgment may go in your favour, if it goes that far.

Additionally, I have an account with Equifax where I can get a credit rating report online for about £12 and it shows all the previous addresses.

You could also ask the utilities to provide you copies of bills for that address in your name but this may prove troublesome. My earlier suggestion would be the best option. Any creditor has to show you are liable for a debt

[Astaroth]

Jonathan

For your information, the "incident" occures from when I lived in Scotland so will come under scottish law.

I will definately have the "case" that I was at university at the time and so should have been exempt for it on the grounds of being a full time student - as were the other residents of the property (the actually tax is £53.30 and I was at the property for a little over a year and never paid any other payments)

I have been read the letter over the phone and they say the charge is now £272.10 due to the costs of tracing and going to the sheriffs court (equiv to our magistrates from what I can make out).... I am also concerned that as the "court" has decided I am liable that I may have difficulty arguing the student aspect so want to double confirm the date issue as it feels more of a definate thing.

[bwglaw]

For your information, the "incident" occures from when I lived in Scotland so will come under scottish law.

Yes, even so, you are still entitled to documentation to show liability. Scottish law is not so greatly different from the laws of England and Wales, except the legal procedure.

I will definately have the "case" that I was at university at the time and so should have been exempt for it on the grounds of being a full time student - as were the other residents of the property (the actually tax is £53.30 and I was at the property for a little over a year and never paid any other payments)

A letter from your University will be able to confirm you were a full time student at the time and they could also confirm your address at the time too.

I have been read the letter over the phone and they say the charge is now £272.10 due to the costs of tracing and going to the sheriffs court (equiv to our magistrates from what I can make out).... I am also concerned that as the "court" has decided I am liable that I may have difficulty arguing the student aspect so want to double confirm the date issue as it feels more of a definate thing.

I think Sherriff Court is the equivalent of our County Courts. You should write to the Court to have the judgment set aside on the grounds that you had not technically 'absconded' and did not have the opportunity to put in a reply or a defence. If a defendant does not turn up at a hearing the Court is likely to enter judgment in favour of the claimant. I advise you to get in touch with the Court ASAP because it appears that judgment has been entered against you already.

You will need to ensure that the claimant has followed the correct procedure because if they have traced you to London and they knew you lived there and had not actually served the documents at the new address this will be good grounds for setting aside the judgment. Arguably, they would not be able to recover the tracing costs because they had (if that's the case) acted unreasonably.

[Astaroth]

They have actually written to my Aunts address as a c/o for myself. My mother lived there for 6 months but left approximately 18 months ago.

Having needed to trace people previously I am assuming they traced me back to my parents address and then traced her forward to when she was living with her sister.

My other issue is that the alleged debt is from 2001. For the last 4 years I have worked for a banking group, applied for credit, had bank accounts etc and so havent exactly been trying to fly under the radar of "big brother". So to me it doesnt appear that they have made any real attempt to trace me at all - after all Telewest "found me" when I moved from the address in question to the next one within 6 months -v- the almost 5 years it appears it has taken the council to find my relative but have still failed to find me personally.

[bwglaw]

Astaroth

Exactly my point - tracing normally takes place before legal proceedings start so the claim form can be served upon you. However, a claimant can serve on the 'last known address' - whether serving on a relative is effective service depends on the Court's rules, which may be different to here. Have you actually lived with this relative, if not, arguably it is not your 'last known address' - this won't be a valid argument to evade liability but a valid argument for the judgment to be set aside.

I think you should put your points in writing to the Sherriff Court. You may have to make an Application to Set Aside Judgment (as it is in E&W) and make your points, brief but to the point and request a hearing. You may have to pay a fee. Here the fee is £60.

If you chose not to contact the Court you may have a CCJ on your record for 6 years and this could affect your credit rating etc. Additionally, the claimant may make an application for a warrant of execution i.e. a bailiff to seize your goods, and the costs will increase.