VAT registration threshold - UK-only turnover?

[privateer]

Have been puzzling over this VAT threshold issue, and am just checking that I've got the right end of HMRC's stick. On the HMRC Web site I read:

"If you supply goods and services both inside and outside the UK, then you may need to register for UK VAT if your UK trade alone exceeds the registration threshold.
You don't need to include supplies you make to other countries when calculating your VAT taxable turnover for registration purposes - so leave out of your calculation any goods you supply to other countries, including distance sales, and any services you supply where the place of supply is another country rather than the UK."

My total turnover is now close to the £68000 threshold. So firth thing tomorrow, I'll do a careful calc of how it's split: UK, rest-of-EU and rest-of-World. I'm sure UK-only will be quite a lot less than £68,000.

I'd prefer to defer registering for VAT (I don't really like being an unpaid tax collector for HMG, although I suppose it's inevitable at some point).

Anyone here able to confirm that the above is correct?

[privateer]

(polite cough)

Any thoughts? Is this correct? I'd have thought that it would have affected a lot of Internet shops.

I've now been through my 09-10 spreadsheet to check and my UK sales is still under £50,000.

[Mpg]

Have been puzzling over this VAT threshold issue, and am just checking that I've got the right end of HMRC's stick. On the HMRC Web site I read:

"If you supply goods and services both inside and outside the UK, then you may need to register for UK VAT if your UK trade alone exceeds the registration threshold.
You don't need to include supplies you make to other countries when calculating your VAT taxable turnover for registration purposes - so leave out of your calculation any goods you supply to other countries, including distance sales, and any services you supply where the place of supply is another country rather than the UK."

My total turnover is now close to the £68000 threshold. So firth thing tomorrow, I'll do a careful calc of how it's split: UK, rest-of-EU and rest-of-World. I'm sure UK-only will be quite a lot less than £68,000.

I'd prefer to defer registering for VAT (I don't really like being an unpaid tax collector for HMG, although I suppose it's inevitable at some point).

Anyone here able to confirm that the above is correct?

Sorry I cant offer any proffesional advise.

But what I have Highlighted is wrong. The nice Vat man will let you claim the VAT back on your business purchases. I'm £1500-£2000 a quarter better off since going VAT registered. So I wouldnt say its unpaid as such. But it all depends on what your business does.

I also see like you that you only need to calculate the UK portion

[privateer]

I buy stuff and sell it, so VAT means me collecting tax on the higher prices I charge to customers, and then subtracting the (rather lower) VAT paid on my supplies. :(

Any accountants feel like answering my UK-sales only Q?

(ever hopeful)

[Mpg]

if its B2B then its worth it if your B2C then most probably not then.

And I'm sure an accountant will be around sooner or later

[privateer]

?

(free pack of Jaffa Cakes - genuine, not the Lidl's poor quality copies - to any accountant who will give a yes/no/maybe answer)

[sheelagh]

Well, as you might know ,the rules have changed recently, and many of us are reeling from the confusion of it all.
Have you read about the new cross boarder changes here
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/cross-border-changes-2010.htm

Have a look at the section "Calculating your VAT Taxable Turnover" here

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/start/register/when-to-register.htm#6

I'm not sure (becuase I am not sure about anything VAT since the rules changed!!) if you should include sales to customers in the EU who are not VAT registered ( ie individuals) but I expect you do have to.

So I THINK your turnover is UK sales + EU sales to private individuals + the value of any supplies (goods and services) you buy from EU suppliers.

For Jaffa cake delivery, please see my website, and if you can't find it on Google, I probably don't deserve them.

[privateer]

Have a look at the section "Calculating your VAT Taxable Turnover" here

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/start/register/when-to-register.htm#6



Thanks for stepping up :)

But that's another page that says UK sales alone for VAT threshold (the 3 other sources of value that are mentioned do not apply to me as I: do not barter; have no reverse VAT charges from EU suppliers and haven't built a business building over £100000 in value).

The 2010 cross border changes also do not apply to me (...yet). "UK VAT-registered businesses that supply goods to other EU countries already submit ESLs. From 1 January 2010 new rules will: * Reduce the time available to submit ESLs in line with the limits above. * As an anti-fraud measure, require the monthly submission of ESLs where the value of the supplies of intra-Community goods (excluding VAT) exceeds £70,000 in the current quarter, or any of the previous four quarters. This threshold will be reduced to £35,000 (excluding VAT) with effect from 1 January 2012."

The cross-border changes also affect supply of services, but I don't do that, either.

Don't worry - you're not alone. This afternoon, I called HMRC, and the guy I spoke to directly contradicted the HMRC Web site, even after speaking to a 'technical department'. The guy didn't want to look at the relevant page and said he'd get someone technical to call me back...

FYI, I've searched and found the same Q on other small business forums. Including one (person selling craft sales) where a guy running an HMRC training course gave the wrong info.

I'll report back... (while trying not to scoff the Jaffa Cakes in the meantime)

[Antiquesman]

Just bumping this thread to see if there was a concrete answer to the opening post.

Thanks