VOIP Phones Question

[DuaneJackson]

I think there are a few people here who know a lot about VOIP...

If I buy two or more Voip hardphones (ie, real phones, not software), firstly, am i right in asuming I can just plug these into my Lan via an RJ45?

Secondly, am I right in assuming all 2+ phones can be logged in to the same account and they will all ring when a call comes in and we can then transfer calls between the phones?

Thirdly, can I have more than one call going on at one time - ie, if i am on a call and another call comes in, will one of the other phones still ring?

Fourthly - my GOD! These phones are so expensive!

[Urban Space]

am i right in asuming I can just plug these into my Lan via an RJ45?

They go in your USB port I think.

I think one of the mods specialises in VoiP phones!

Hope that helps

Liam

[cjd]

Well I do know somefink about this ;-)

You can get USB hardware phones - they're ok, they work but they're not for business use really.

I think you really mean real telephones like these:

https://www.voipfone.co.uk/shop.php

They plug into your router through RJ45 connectors which means they're not dependent on your PC being on - they're on all the time like an ordinary phone.

To have more than 1 working on 1 account you need to use the PBX functions and get extensions. With us they cost 99p per month each and there's a theoretical limit of about 800. You can set all the phones to ring when a call comes in or just the master phone with a receptionist for example or you can bolt a call queue in front of them - all phones then have voicemail, call tranfer, music on hold etc etc. An extension can be anywhere in the world and calls between them are free.

You can make and receive as many simultaneous calls as you, your network and your telephones can deal with. On a normal broadband connection 4 is optimal but we have companies with 8-10 and more on one 2mb line.

The good phones are expensive but getting better and cheaper. You can get cheap ones that work very well - try a decent ebay trader, you want a SIP based VoIP phone - but their build quality is too poor for a provider like us to support with any confidence - they tend to fall to bits with heavy use.

Have a look at this draft text.

http://www.voipfone.co.uk/colin/vpbx.htm

[DuaneJackson]

Thanks Colin,

The prices of the phone on your site are quite competitive - and as they come pre-cofigured to your netwrok I think I just might grab one or two from there.

A quick question though - I've noticed some of these phones say they are "single line" - what does this mean? Does it mean I can only have one call at a time? IE, a call can't be transferred to me if i am already on a call?

[Asteeleleith]

i must admit i went with skype. www.skpye.com
It a fanastic addtional feature to my laptop i think. Plus it allows me to take the strain off my mobile phone credits into the bargain. Esp wen the old dear phones lol
as though i have no plans to use it as an extra line idea for business. I will see that one goes :-)

Al

[cjd]

Thanks Colin,

The prices of the phone on your site are quite competitive - and as they come pre-cofigured to your netwrok I think I just might grab one or two from there.

A quick question though - I've noticed some of these phones say they are "single line" - what does this mean? Does it mean I can only have one call at a time? IE, a call can't be transferred to me if i am already on a call?

The use of the word 'line' is missleading with VoIP, it comes from the old days of course, were you needed a physical line for every simultaneous phone call.

With VoIP you can have as many simultaneous calls going on as you or your network can handle. Calls use about 80K bandwidth, the contraining factor then (for external calls) is the uplink to the internet which is typically only 256K. In practise this means that you can comfortably handle 4 and in the real world 6-8. You can have many more extension of course, because if have say 10 extensions it would be a statistical rareity for all 10 to be simultaneously busy - unless you run a call centre.

For big installations you would use SDSL (Synchronous version of ADSL)

Anyway - most phones can handle several simultaneous calls, the snom 320 is 12 - I think, the sipura is 2 upgradable to 4. Personally I find I can't have more than 2 calls going at once - one on hold one talking.....

[DuaneJackson]

OK, that's me sold. Anyone want to buy a Panasonic Digital Exchnage that supports 4 CO's with 8 handsets? I don't think I'm going to need it anymore.

I'll have a look around to see if I can get the Sipura SPA-841 at a better price anywhere else, if not then I'll get 2 from you.

[Asteeleleith]

i still find times wen talking to friends on skpye that the convo can be hindered sometimes. So i am waiting for a whil before i use skpe or VoIP as the main line for my business :-)

Al

[DuaneJackson]

Try something besides Skype. They're probably the most well known, but not the best.

I was expecting to have the same problem myself. But it was only this morning that I realised that I've been using VOIP for a few days and not even noticed any problems. Yet, anyway!

[Cornish Steve]

I've learned not to assume that others can hear me clearly just because I can hear them. Download speeds are a lot faster than upload speeds, as I understand it. Nowadays, if I'm using VoIP, I ask the called party whether they can hear me clearly.

I've found that the quality of service is critically dependent on the bandwidth of the connection. For this reason, I can imagine that there will be problems if you use more than one VoIP phone concurrently.

[cjd]

Bandwidth is critical but if you have the standard 256 up 2 meg down ADSL there should be no problems at all with 2 or more conversations. Particularly if you have a modern router with QoS so that voice traffic is prioritised.

If you are having problems it's normally either a local firewall issue (you get one way sound only), or soundcard or headset problem.

For business use you should buy a proper SIP telephone or adapter - the headset/PC thing is ok for students and cheap calls to the family but it's not for real business use.

The Snom phones are the best in the world at the moment with sound quality at CD level - far better than ordinary telephony as it's 64 kb digital, but they are expensive.

[Top Hat]

I've just bought some of the phone today (from voipphone), I will let you know how I get on.

If it works as well as I hope then I think this kind of system is the future, expandable, transportable and cheep. I hope it works!!

[cjd]

It will, or I'll eat your hat.

[DuaneJackson]

Let us know how you get on with it TopHat - which did yo go for? After a bit oflooking around I'm seriously considering two SNOM 360s. The Sipuras look cheap too.

[seabro]

When I first started using VOIP I made the mistake of trying to have a conversation while another PC on my network was up/downloading files from a p2p network. Quality was awful!

Immediate improvement once program was closed.


Just something to keep in mind!

[Top Hat]

Let us know how you get on with it TopHat - which did yo go for? After a bit oflooking around I'm seriously considering two SNOM 360s. The Sipuras look cheap too.

I've got the snom 320's and they have just arrived.

Not sure I'll get much of a play until the new year

[cjd]

When I first started using VOIP I made the mistake of trying to have a conversation while another PC on my network was up/downloading files from a p2p network. Quality was awful!

Immediate improvement once program was closed.


Just something to keep in mind!

Uploading causes the most problems as the uplink is only 256kb. You can solve it by using a router with QoS (Quality of Service). It prioritises voice traffic over non-voice; most new routers have it tho' some do it better than others.

[scope]

It shouldn't matter about having other programmes running - it doesn't affect ours. There are decent VoIP products out there now, its just a shame that the initial launch of VoIp was hampered by poor technology.

Check out voicenet-solutions.com, - they have all the bases covered: Security, line quality, price, calling waiting, conferencing, you name it they have it - i think they do deals about spreading the cost of phones, give them a ring and find out.

[seabro]

scope,

If I have DC++ running flat-out downloading and uploading at the same time it makes my voip service completely un-useable.

This is because all the bandwidth is fully utilised.

A router supporting QOS would know which data was more time critical and give voip traffic priority.. but i dont have one :-(

I use voiptalk.org as a voip provider, when I am not downloading it is great. Shame about the tech support thats all.

cheers

[sapphirewebdesign]

I would recommend www.sipgate.co.uk as a provider

[Pixels Ink]

I use a VoIP service (freetalk.co.uk) and I think it's great. It has saved me a fortune on phone bills each month. Down from around £50-60 to a flat £7 fee!

But yeah, if you have P2P software running the service becomes unstable due to a lot of the upload bandwidth being taken up.

Colin

[VeryMark]

We use Vonage for an extra line and find it cost effective - £10 per month all in, a set up fee of around £30 which includes a preconfigured router and you plug in an ordinary phone. Dead easy to set up too.

[Nomisconnections]

There are many business solutions in the market, they include voice mail, music on hold, reception phone etc. It is worth you looking for these if you are seriously looking to replace a traditional Panasonic PBX. Voice quality depends on whether your ISP provides 20:1 contention ratio and realisticaly the uplink to the Internet is only 180-200K. If it will be your lifeline, consider a dedicated Broadband connection for voice calls.

[DuaneJackson]

Well, I played with 2 Phones. And didn't get on with it all in the end.

There was some noise on the line that was unacceptable for sales calls. This may be related to the amount of network cabling in the office or the GSM transmitter a few meteres above in the roof.

The facility to transfer calls isn't ideal, and one phone kept tellling the world it was enagaged (not ringing on incoming calls - sending transferred calls to voicemail, etc) It wasn't in DND mode.

I think I'll send them back and get the PBX patched in again.

[cjd]

Sounds like you're not set up correctly - why not email for help - I've heard they're pretty good ;-)

[peter@CDN]

Using VOIP for business is great but you need it to be reliable and provide all the right features. check out www.cd-networks.co.uk for more information or send an e-mail to peter.haigh@cd-networks.co.uk

Peter

[Pebble Communications]

Hello,

One of my clients is a (business only) telecomms supplier and they do voip, standard landlines, whole phone systems, conference calls, switchboard, IDSN, broadband, basically you name it, they do it.

They really know what they are talking about and I know it is a cliche, but the whole big enough to cope, small enough to care thing, is them. They work with companies of all sizes and usually save them 10-15% on existing call charges.

If anyone wants a quote from them PM me and I'll pass on your details with a note that you are a friend of mine! All they need is your last phone bill or 2 to work out a cost comparison.

Fiona Bailey
www.pebblecommunications.co.uk

[Rabbit4less]

Like PixelsInc, I'm loving freetalk. I bought the One Year package (even cheaper, at £80 for a year, inclusive of all UK landline calls). The best thing though is the functionality - for example, you get to choose your own area code. That means, I can be working in Cornwall (or anywhere in the world with a broadband connection) and the world can still call me on my London number. There's loads more info at www.freetalk.co.uk It's early days, but I reckon VoIP is going to be huge in 2006

[VeryMark]

Yes, you can choose your own area code with Vonage too, and you get things like hunt groups and diversion on busy or no answer for free too.

[DarrenC]

Whilst I love technology, and embrace it (I'm watching iRobots on the laptop via Sky Broadband as I am typing this!) I think some things are not meant to be.

I'm going to stick with my cordless digital telephone, and £10 a month unlimited telephone calls (24 hours a day!)

Darren

[cjd]

Whilst I love technology, and embrace it (I'm watching iRobots on the laptop via Sky Broadband as I am typing this!) I think some things are not meant to be.

Darren

Well, you may be surprised to hear that pretty much every call you make today will be VoIP at some stage of it's journey. That's because it's such an efficient protocol that it's already implemented between networks.

BT is now rebuilding its entire network to convert to it (they call it their 21 Century network) and it will be complete by the end of the decade.

There is no hiding place :-)

It's worth remembering though, if all you want is cheap phone calls, the CPS services are still the cheapest and you can use them from your existing telephone. VoIP is about FREE calls and very low cost advanced services - particularly for small businesses.

[VeryMark]

Since VOIP is an add-on through the broadband on your existing landline, if you only need one phone then switching your calls to a cheaper provider with CPS is of course a better option.

[Rabbit4less]

Darren,
Looking at your holiday villas profile, I'm guessing you or people you work with might call the UK from overseas! A VoIP service would give you a UK geographic number which you could plug into broadband in Spain, or Italy, or wherever. I use my freetalk box in Italy a lot - people calling me call a UK number (and it costs them the same as if I was back in the UK) and I still get to call everyone in the UK for free - CPS cannot do this!
Note to Crossguard - even if you only need one line, VoIP with a geographic number is cheaper. freetalk is £80 for a year, all UK landline calls included. How much are you paying for an inclusive CPS plan?

[DarrenC]

I know I know - I'm sure it's great, and I'm probably being ignorant, because I know nothing much about Voip - I tried skype and wasn't that impressed with the quality.

I like your point on holidaymakers though - wonder what percentage of holidaymakers nowadays though take the laptop abroad with them?