How about some kind of SEO competition

[WPsites]

After following a thread on 'Why Do SEOs Suck?' it got me thinking.

Lots of companies come on this forum not knowing where to turn for SEO. Lots of people on this forum seem to think they are very good at SEO.

How about a competition!?

In a number of threads iv seen people saying onpage SEO can get first page listings with no link building and well written copy is king. I personaly don't rate onpage SEO but I would love to run some tests to learn from.

We could have an SEO comp, where even the people that arent professional SEO's (the ones who wouldnt ever pay for a professional SEO) can compete with the people that do this fulltime.

I'm not sure how this would work but I think it would be a more level playing field if this was onpage optimisation only (no link building (not sure how feasible that is)). Otherwise the person with the biggest and best network would trump everyone else, simply by promoting their comp entry with a network of inbound links. At the same time we could learn a lot about the power of onpage SEO

Maybe we could all promote an affiliate program (exactly the same one) pool the commissions which would act as the prize fund. The SEO that contributes the most to the commission wins the pot or a big share of it.

We could run the competition for 3 months then at the end of it we could end up with a league table which could be published on uk business forum.

As a group I think we would learn a lot and we would know who walks the walk!!

I'm just thinking out loud guys!

Simon

[Place of design]

After following a thread on 'Why Do SEOs Suck?' it got me thinking.

Lots of companies come on this forum not knowing where to turn for SEO. Lots of people on this forum seem to think they are very good at SEO.

How about a competition!?

In a number of threads iv seen people saying onpage SEO can get first page listings with no link building and well written copy is king. I personaly don't rate onpage SEO but I would love to run some tests to learn from.

We could have an SEO comp, where even the people that arent professional SEO's (the ones who wouldnt ever pay for a professional SEO) can compete with the people that do this fulltime.

I'm not sure how this would work but I think it would be a more level playing field if this was onpage optimisation only (no link building (not sure how feasible that is)). Otherwise the person with the biggest and best network would trump everyone else, simply by promoting their comp entry with a network of inbound links. At the same time we could learn a lot about the power of onpage SEO

Maybe we could all promote an affiliate program (exactly the same one) pool the commissions which would act as the prize fund. The SEO that contributes the most to the commission wins the pot or a big share of it.

We could run the competition for 3 months then at the end of it we could end up with a league table which could be published on uk business forum.

As a group I think we would learn a lot and we would know who walks the walk!!

I'm just thinking out loud guys!

Simon


3 months is such a short amount of time.. performance over a prolonged period would be much more useful

[WPsites]

3 months is such a short amount of time.. performance over a prolonged period would be much more useful

Ok so maybe more like 6 months.

We could work together to come up with the competition rules. Organise something that will be a learning experience for everyone, sort the men from the boys and maybe even walk away with a prize at the end of it.

[Ali-v-8]

keyword single phrase.
2 stages
first one there
who is there in 6 months time.
blackhat is banned
you must follow techniques you have posted
eg if you have said in the forum metas dont matter then you either put up or stand down.
linking from sites and full costing (ie if free then write free) on what would be charged will b the over all point of excersise. "whp has the most cost effective solution"

i think i like this idea

[cmcp]

You can't control that environment - I know the first thing I'd do would be link farm the competitors and drop a few anonymous tipoffs.

[sirearl]

Who's going to put up the 100k prize money.?

Earl

[Ali-v-8]

bet we could get a client.
he could end up the owner of the website as well as receiving the advertising kudos

[WPsites]

Everyones competition site could be promoting the same affiliate offer. With all of our commissions going into the same pot which could be shared between the winners.

[WPsites]

You can't control that environment - I know the first thing I'd do would be link farm the competitors and drop a few anonymous tipoffs.

Maybe if the competition was running for 2 years.

It would be impossible to run this as an onpage only SEO competition. Anyone, even someone not in the comp could link to others sites and they would win the comp hands down against other competitors with no linking.

Full-on SEO battle it is then

[Ali-v-8]

so its a case o finding a competition sponsor. market the product and winner gets the pot.

[irishguru]

Execution of this would be very difficult.

It's an idea but not something that will be made possible very easily.

Maybe a competiton for the best SEO advice/tip would be more appropriate?

[willitbe]

This would be pretty much impossible to implement.

Let's say 10 people took part, that's ten websites to be built from scratch for a start!.

Now I am only a mere human and my insight into human behaviour predicts that no-one in their right mind would be prepared to build, tweak and then follow a websites progress for 6 months just for a bit of Kudos and then have their on-site tactics (and any cheeky off-site tactics too) on display for all and sundry to copy and pillage for future use.

SEO is just one of those things in life where you pay up front, don't get to know what's been done and spend the next 2 years as a "mushroom".

No other service like it in the world!:p

[Ali-v-8]

I must be a rare SEO.
I am up for it.
And here come the point "proof will be there for all the forum to scrutinise".
If you aint got nothing to hide then you will nothing to fear.
as for people copying seo is bespoke to every site you create.
Certain aspects can be mimicked but not copied.
If your an SEO (so called) then it wont be something that you dont already know.
Finally it will be policed by everyone. any cheats are going to be spotted a mile off. How? Because we are all SEO's





This would be pretty much impossible to implement.

Let's say 10 people took part, that's ten websites to be built from scratch for a start!.

Now I am only a mere human and my insight into human behaviour predicts that no-one in their right mind would be prepared to build, tweak and then follow a websites progress for 6 months just for a bit of Kudos and then have their on-site tactics (and any cheeky off-site tactics too) on display for all and sundry to copy and pillage for future use.

SEO is just one of those things in life where you pay up front, don't get to know what's been done and spend the next 2 years as a "mushroom".

No other service like it in the world!:p

[Mystro]

Well i bet your customers wont be happy you spending all your time for a bit of honour, when you should be working on thier sites.

This totally is against everything i have heard on here, for instance why top Seo's are not in the top spots on search engines for rankings as they dont have the time for their own sites..

Even if some one takes top spot say for instance Ali v 8 and his Google map magic which he does so very well, people in the past have complained of dirty tricks so whats the point it will be a waste of resource.

I for one already have my opinions of who is good and who is not, im sure others will too if they spend the time here

Just my thoughts

Paul

[petera]

I'd be well up for the competition but, like most others on here, I don't know how we could create a totally level playing field.

My suggestion would be that we all start a simple wordpress blog (hosted on wordpress) targeting the same keyphrase and see who is nearest the top after a 4 month period.
I also think we should stipulate that this must be done with no financial outlay. All links must be built at no cost - anyone can buy links or hire an external company to link build for them. If you have an existing link building network then you should be allowed to use it, after all you'd use it for a client campaign so it's fair game.

[James1980]

SEO contests have been done before, with gurus competing to get to #1 ranking for phrases like "Nigritude ultramarine" or "Seraphim proudleduck". Wikipedia, as ever, has more info:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SEO_contest



James

[awebapart.com]

Lots of people on this forum seem to think they are very good at SEO.

How about a competition!?
SEOs and others on this forum seldom agree on any SEO subject, there is usually a difference of opinion, do you honestly think we would reach agreement on the terms of an SEO competition or its judging criteria!

I'm not sure how this would work but I think it would be a more level playing field if this was onpage optimisation only (no link building (not sure how feasible that is)).
It is impossible to say no inbound linking, since:

1. It is so easy to cheat without being detected by indirectly using other domains and 301 permanent redirects.

2. It is so easy to sabotage another competitor entry, make it look like they are breaking the rules, by placing a detectable link to the other person's site

3. Once sites start getting ranked and visited you cannot stop other people linking to them

Since it is impossible to prevent inbound linking, you then end up with a competition where there isn't a level playing field for the reasons you mention...

Otherwise the person with the biggest and best network would trump everyone else, simply by promoting their comp entry with a network of inbound links.
If it is an onsite SEO competition then it would have to be a new site, rather than pages on an existing site, for similar reasons.

To make it as level a playing field as possible, the competition organiser should just purchase some new neutral similar domain names at the same time, e.g. 8 digit number .co.uk domains (79038645.co.uk) and assign them to the contestants.

But because of the reasons mentioned above, it would still never be a level playing field.

[petera]

Look, if we're not putting any of our own money on the line then hopefully everyone will see it as a bit of fun.
We just have to trust each other not to sabotage or use any dubious tactics but even if someone does, what do they stand to gain? Winning a competition that doesn't matter a jot outside of this forum.

This is just a bit of a laugh as far as i'm concerned. If I want to prove my SEO knowledge and skills to everyone on the forum i'll just point them in the direction of my client's rankings.

Am I the best SEO in the world? No
Do I know how to get websites ranking well? Yes
Am I prepared to prove this in a competition? Yes

That's all there is to it.

[sirearl]

I'd be well up for the competition but, like most others on here, I don't know how we could create a totally level playing field.



Exactly hence why I would not participate not to mention that wasting a lot of time and effort on something that is not producing more food for my cats is not in my agenda of important things to do.

I am also involved in some pretty stiff competitions on google which do feed the cats..;)

Earl

[WPsites]

This is just a bit of a laugh as far as i'm concerned. If I want to prove my SEO knowledge and skills to everyone on the forum i'll just point them in the direction of my client's rankings.

I'd just like to see who can promote a brand new site. Trophy rankings built in 2005 when anyone linked to anyone doesn't impress me. I'm not saying this is all you have petera but I think promoting a fresh new site in today's world of nofollow is much more of a test of ones SEO abilities.

[WPsites]

I am also involved in some pretty stiff competitions on google which do feed the cats..;)

I hope that doll + bear site isn't feeding the cats!

[petera]

I'd just like to see who can promote a brand new site. Trophy rankings built in 2005 when anyone linked to anyone doesn't impress me. I'm not saying this is all you have petera but I think promoting a fresh new site in today's world of nofollow is much more of a test of ones SEO abilities.

Hence the reason I said I would take part.

I've just taken a brand new domain to the first page of Google for a reasonably competitive keyphrase in just 3 months. In doing so I haven't bought any links and I don't have a network of my own sites to use.

I wouldn't take part if I didn't think I could do it.

[sirearl]

I'd just like to see who can promote a brand new site. Trophy rankings built in 2005 when anyone linked to anyone doesn't impress me. I'm not saying this is all you have petera but I think promoting a fresh new site in today's world of nofollow is much more of a test of ones SEO abilities.

quite agree hence why In the main I don't bother on the grounds that an easy life is preferable to a hard one.

Earl

[TheSlackers]

I think it's a good idea and with a little bit of work from UKBF would work well. Awards for #1 after a week, month, 3 months, 6 month and a year for SEO's to display on their site would be a nice trophy.

I think people are a bit blinded by the here and now, yes there would be no prize but what about the potential for new clients? How many people looking for an SEO find there way to this board every day? It's one thing saying/thinking you're one of the top SEO's here but if you could actually prove it, now that would make your services more attractive :)

[OldWelshGuy]

This would be pretty much impossible to implement.

Let's say 10 people took part, that's ten websites to be built from scratch for a start!.

Now I am only a mere human and my insight into human behaviour predicts that no-one in their right mind would be prepared to build, tweak and then follow a websites progress for 6 months just for a bit of Kudos and then have their on-site tactics (and any cheeky off-site tactics too) on display for all and sundry to copy and pillage for future use.

SEO is just one of those things in life where you pay up front, don't get to know what's been done and spend the next 2 years as a "mushroom".

No other service like it in the world!:p


Give the man a cigar.

By the way, this is an old old old game that SEO's have played for years. We originally did it on Altavista when you could submit a new page and get it spidered within 15 minutes and view the results of your work (it was how we originally reverse engineered search algorithms :)

We would stay up all night raging against the machine, and come morning there could only be one winner.


Elursrebmem, ultramarine etc.

[sirearl]

I think it's a good idea and with a little bit of work from UKBF would work well. Awards for #1 after a week, month, 3 months, 6 month and a year for SEO's to display on their site would be a nice trophy.

I think people are a bit blinded by the here and now, yes there would be no prize but what about the potential for new clients? How many people looking for an SEO find there way to this board every day? It's one thing saying/thinking you're one of the top SEO's here but if you could actually prove it, now that would make your services more attractive :)

Its pretty easy to prove with your actuall results,or am I missing something.:|:)

yer but yer but yer but :p

Earl

[TheSlackers]

Give the man a cigar.



Couldn't I just nip over to Umbrella and have a look though? Or any SEO's site for that matter? Many on here will post up there clients anyway either to thier site or this forum.

Its pretty easy to prove with your actuall results,or am I missing something.:|:)

Earl

What actual results would they be?

[sirearl]

What actual results would they be?

They would be each participating SEO's results.;)

Earl

[OldWelshGuy]

Couldn't I just nip over to Umbrella and have a look though? Or any SEO's site for that matter? Many on here will post up there clients anyway either to thier site or this forum.


By all means visit, but the point is that a web marketer should never broadcast their client sites, because doing that exposes their client to competition and introduces risk.

You should also cover your tracks with regard off page work, make it 'less than easy' for someone to reverse engineer your linking strategy etc.

[OldWelshGuy]

As an asside, in many of the SEO competitions, competitors were regul;arly taken out. it is impossible to police sabotage.

[sirearl]

By all means visit, but the point is that a web marketer should never broadcast their client sites, because doing that exposes their client to competition and introduces risk.



Yer one would not want people looking at clients sites.:|:D:D

I would imagine than any compertition is very well aware of your clients sites.:p

Risk is that for people of a nervous disposition.?;)

Earl

[TheSlackers]

As an asside, in many of the SEO competitions, competitors were regul;arly taken out. it is impossible to police sabotage.

Why would you want to police it? If that gets you to #1 then you win :)

[Ali-v-8]

he is on about google bomb and multiple links that would get your site wiped

[OldWelshGuy]

Why would you want to police it? If that gets you to #1 then you win :)

All competitions have rules. But many willplay outside those rules. They will take out a competitors website in order to win. It is notoriously difficult for the organisers to police it.