Dragon's Den [Archive] - UK Business Forums

YEM

15th November 2005, 15:37

We recently interviewed Bob Nurburn, originally from Wigan, who will be appearing on the New series of Dragon's Den, which starts tonight at 8pm on BBC2.

If I remember correctly, Bob is not featured on tonights show but (and I will clarify this) in 2 weeks

Lucy

15th November 2005, 20:06

Just watched this evenings Dragons' Den. The guy with the wifi internet access business for Marinas had the Dragon's selling themselves to him trying to get him to accept their offers. Interesting development.

Anyone know if they have done Dragons Den revisisted from previous series to find out how people have got on?

GJ

SanaerJewelleryCreations

15th November 2005, 23:31

I love this programme!!!!!

Rachel looked a bit`sheepish`,didn't she...red letter days indeed!!!!!

They love to crucifiy,don't they...the dragons only seem to be into the big `important` business ideas,and seem to treat the `novelty` ideas as a bit of a joke!!!!!

I love the more `quirkey`ideas....

It is must-see T.V. though....there is some sort of Dragons Den, going on at the Excel Business-start-up,coming up at the end of november....

Is anyone going.... :)

Adrian S.J.C.

Mark Pocock

16th November 2005, 05:35

Thought the olive idea was interesting...if she got herself a reliable supplier.

Doug was too greedy asking for 45% when sailing and wifi was right up his street.

Must be awful presenting in front of the dragons.

MarkPearson

16th November 2005, 05:53

I do like this show a lot.

A lot of important lessens can be learnt by watching such shows.

Richard Conyard

16th November 2005, 07:37

Actually seen the Olives at my local. They were popular with some people, I felt they tasted awful - all told they were dropped after a couple of months because they didn't generate enough sales.

The woman selling the Olive idea had no concept of pitching for business. The guy with the WIFI had a better idea (did you note how quick and non-technical his pitch was?).

The one thing I found interesting was that everyone presented an idea, and no one presented a business plan/business history.

Real World Hypnotherapy

16th November 2005, 10:50

You can tell they have some people on just to make it interesting viewing.

At the end of the day if you have a solid idea, you seem competent and you can make them money, then they will invest in you.

It really annoys me when people don’t listen and don’t do their research into the business and markets. That woman who bought 1000’s of pairs of pants with names on, would anyone here invest in her? She was unprofessional and even cried. Then you get someone like the Wifi dude who looked right, knew what he wanted and make a good case for himself.

It is good to watch and it is too easy to criticise others saying how you would do it completely differently. Like when you are watching football and you know that you could have made a better pass or got it on target. I do find myself shouting at the TV a lot of the time.

What people seem to forget is that the money is only a small fraction of what the dragons are offering, their time and experience is worth much much more than the investment you went in for. I always believe it is better to have a slice of something that exists rather than the whole of nothing.

Rant over

Matt

Top Hat

16th November 2005, 15:08

I enjoy the program.

I like the way the dragons cut straight to the problem, be it personnel, lack of financial planning, poor initial sales, blind optimism.

Richard Conyard

16th November 2005, 15:12

True, but I wasn't so keen on the walk away with a deal, or walk away with nothing approach.

Although those presenting are favoured by pitching to people they would never normally get in front of, the dragons are favoured in the fact the additional presure is there to get the deal they want.

MorethanWords

16th November 2005, 15:13

The knickers woman was pure crazy. As if you'd order 180,000 pairs of knickers without some kind of money to back it up?!

The WIFI guy was great because he presented his pitch really well and had confidence (and a plan) to back it up rather than going in and waffling.

directmarketingadvice

16th November 2005, 16:52

The knickers woman was pure crazy. As if you'd order 180,000 pairs of knickers without some kind of money to back it up?!

I felt sorry for her. She had clearly got herself in a hole and had no idea how to get out.

Frankly, I thought it was a little exploitative to have her on. She clearly wasn't a contender for investment.

However, that's TV.

Steve

SanaerJewelleryCreations

16th November 2005, 17:03

This was made before Rachel's Red Letter days,went `belly-up`,wasn't it ???don't get me wrong,she has made more money than I have,but,I have heard some quite lurid stories about her in the Daily Mail.
I had to smile,at the point where she was prepared to give the wi-fi guy £150,000 for 38% of the business...when her own company was millions in debt....THE GALL OF THE WOMAN!!!!!

Adrian.

p.s. if I could choose one of them to sit down with for half an hour...it would definately be Doug,he oozes absolute confidence,if he told me the moon was made of cheese,I would probably believe him...

MorethanWords

16th November 2005, 17:12

I think it said at the beginning that two of the other dragons bought her out. And she's probably got enough cash stashed to justify the offers! I know what you're saying though.

The knickers woman was pure crazy. As if you'd order 180,000 pairs of knickers without some kind of money to back it up?!

I felt sorry for her. She had clearly got herself in a hole and had no idea how to get out.

Frankly, I thought it was a little exploitative to have her on. She clearly wasn't a contender for investment.

However, that's TV.

Steve

I guess it was a little - and I also felt sorry for her because as she spoke it was as though the reality of what she had done finally hit her.

YEM

17th November 2005, 12:08

This was made before Rachel's Red Letter days,went `belly-up`,wasn't it ???don't get me wrong,she has made more money than I have,but,I have heard some quite lurid stories about her in the Daily Mail.
I had to smile,at the point where she was prepared to give the wi-fi guy £150,000 for 38% of the business...when her own company was millions in debt....THE GALL OF THE WOMAN!!!!!probably believe him...

It did mention at the beginning, that 2 dragons had bought her out and that she was using personal money for the investments. Also, so what if she is in debt, she's done the smart thing and sold out, her experience and advice would possibly be worth more than someone whose business hasn't gone wrong!

Alpha

17th November 2005, 12:39

I managed to watch the program last night.

after the last series I could not believe that many of the people would seriously put themselves up for this unless it was for publicity.

The amounts are so small that most people could obtain that finance with a decent business plan and a bit of vision.

the people who will really get something out of it are those with a decent business plan who lack an area of expertise and could find it from one of the 'dragons'.

i thought that the Wifi guy played them well but again he could have got that sort of expertise coupled with the investment for a much smaller stake by going through the business angels network.

i think most of the others have no serious chance especially the woman with the olives who was too transparent that she really hadn't got clue.

the biggest smile was reserved for the woman who 'didn't have a clue where the money she had had gone but wanted someone elses to loose!!'

wheelie2

23rd November 2005, 20:19

I love this programme. I was on a High growth start up scheme and was asked if I wanted to apply. They sent me a form and called me and I have to say that the questions they asked would definately weed out those businesses destined to be slated, so why do so many still get through? I didn't take it any further in the end as I knew I wasn't ready and would look like a t*t on national tv. Not a good thing.

Great telly.

creative-keyrings

23rd November 2005, 20:52

I personally love the program, that woman with the "pea wee" was a very werid and morally incorrect idea i thought!

Why would woman wanna stand up and pea like us men?

Any answers :D

wheelie2

23rd November 2005, 21:00

Yes, because we're fed up of having to squat in the woods with the stinging nettles. I used to race 4x mountain bikes and still go motocrossing and there's never anywhere to pee! Sorry to be graphic but we can't exactly erm, shake afterwards so I'm not sure I'd use one for hygiene reasons.

fridayteam

23rd November 2005, 23:17

I laughed at the bloke last night with the flushing toilet gadget.

After living in Africa, where you make do with what you can, we just filled up a 1 litre plastic bottle with water and put it in the cystern. Voila!

robbie williams

24th November 2005, 00:03

excellent tv! Watched it for the first time this week and I have to say I am hooked on this show.

Fair play to the chap with the bedlam cube. He really came across well and struck himself up a good deal. By using two of the dragons experience and knowledge I can see big things for this product. $2 to make as well - cracking idea and cracking profit margin.

Has this series just started or is it near the end?

Clare

24th November 2005, 08:27

I really enjoy watching this. Yes, it's made for TV so they're going to show stuff just for that purpose.

Managed to miss most of this weeks (this is only the 2nd week Robbie) but it's always interesting to see the difference in approach, preparedness and confidence from the businesses.

I thought the Bedlam cube was excellent. Last week's Big O was good in concept, probably has a limited market but her attitude was astounding - saying the numbers weren't important and then slatting a whole nation! The guy with the marina Wi-Fi concept was obviously on to a great idea.

YEM

29th November 2005, 17:51

Hi All,

Look out on tonights program for Bob Norburn & Ultra Shave

hairsoup

29th November 2005, 21:52

I couldnt understand why that bloke invested in the baby products business, when earlier in the show his reason for not investing in one of them was that he could easily do it without him, and unless theres something i missed, he could have easily done that business without the woman??

webit

30th November 2005, 05:19

With out the party plan - all he has left is a women who sells baby products which he's going to shift online. emmm.

SillyJokes

30th November 2005, 06:09

He's just had a baby...., he is a multi millionaire..., what else is he going to give his wife?

"Look darling I bought you a baby goods company,"

"That's nice dear,"

(I thought his attitude to going to the toilet was very weird last week - that guy has serious hang ups)

webit

30th November 2005, 07:48

I thought the toliet idea was very good - with some goverment backing it could be a very key item globally but at the end of the day they are not crusaders, they are just looking at a return at exit.

Did you notice how blank the baby woman looked when he mentioned 'better return for you at exit'

What do people think of Theo?

directmarketingadvice

30th November 2005, 08:07

What do people think of Theo?

Apparently, we need him more than he needs us.....

Steve

DML

30th November 2005, 08:15

Personally I do not think that the program is that great. I mean, it makes for good entertainment but thats about it...sort of like The Apprentice.

Why?

Well, you see someone pitching a perfectly good business idea for an investment of £150 000. In my opinion, an amount like that does not justify having to share between 30 and 40% of your business (sometimes even 50)
which is what the dragons ask for most of the time. Would it not be better to write a good business plan and seek investment from a bank or even family and friends.

Last night is a perfect example (the student accomodation guy). The 2 dragons tried to exploit what they perceived to be as a naive businessman. Doug Richards had an idea of what the business would be worth and with all his millions still tried to extort a good entrepreneur.

Having the dragons as business partners is priceless. Their experience and more importantly, their contacts, will open many doors for up and coming businesses.
I just can't help but feel that they are a bunch of venture capitalists trying to swallow you like a hungry lion (except for Peter Jones- good lad).

Am I correct in saying that there is a maximum amount of money that you can ask for (£150k). Wouldn't it be better if there was a maximum amount of share that the Dragons could demand ?

Enough for today :P

robbie williams

30th November 2005, 09:44

I think in the last episode Peter invests £175K in a luxury lifestyle mag.

Personally I think it is great viewing and so does my 9 year old daughter! She was asking all sorts of questions last night! I think she may be a potential millionaire - fingers crossed!

Peter Jones is the only chap I can warm to as an investor. The others come across as sharks.

Going to the bank or friend is not the same as investment from one of these guys. Its not what you know its who you know....

YEM

30th November 2005, 09:45

Well, you see someone pitching a perfectly good business idea for an investment of £150 000. In my opinion, an amount like that does not justify having to share between 30 and 40% of your business (sometimes even 50)
which is what the dragons ask for most of the time. Would it not be better to write a good business plan and seek investment from a bank or even family and friends. P

Your bank and in most cases, friends and family, don't have the experience or contacts that the Dragon's have - they are the kind of people that can aggressively push your product or service to the market, generate national media coverage and make you lots of money, possibly and likely in a short space of time.

SillyJokes

30th November 2005, 10:01

I would question just how much time they do have to put into each business actually.

They can't be everywhere and are naturally going to spend the most time on the things that make the most money.

I reckon you might get a couple of hours out of them, tops, and would need to spend a lot of your time writing complex reports for their digestion.

Theo said of one chap selling camping catering goods that he was a fool to pass up his offer because he (Theo) is a personal friend of the man who owns The Outdoor Shops. So what? If the product is any good then the outdoor shop would sell it anyway, and if it is rubbish then being a personal friend isn't going to have any weight.

Theo, we need you less than you like to think.

Great show, total fantasy, but so much fun to watch.

Stationery-Direct

30th November 2005, 10:19

Noticed a post on another forum saying he was the bloke with the shaving gel, Take a look:

http://www.startups.co.uk/Forums/ShowPost.aspx?PostID=123044

MinuWeb

30th November 2005, 12:08

They need to change the order of the presentations a bit, several no's followed by a rejected offer then a couple more no's and then an accepted offer makes it a bit too easy to predict.

caroline

30th November 2005, 14:27

Loved watching the programme which is very similar to pop idol in my opinion, but I couldn't understand why they invested in the party plan lady for the baby products?

uksbc

30th November 2005, 14:51

i do like watching programmes like Dragons Den or Make Me a Million and it is surprising how much you learn without realising it

one cruel aspect is sometimes you cant help feeling good about yourself and your own business when you see some of the candidates and business proposals

i know they are edited for ratings etc but do you not think sometimes "WHY ARE YOU THERE?"

i obviously want all small business people to succeed and entrepreneurs be encouraged to start businesses (i would have no clients they didnt!) but it amazes me just how dim some people are!

i also have to agree with one of Peters comments last night about appearance - i would not dream of seeing a £100 client in jeans let alone asking someone for £150,000.

ok finished ranting now!!

robbie williams

30th November 2005, 15:43

1st client meetings I wear a suit but 99% of the time as soon as I get to know them I wear what clothes I like... its made no difference to the amount of orders I bring in for the company I work for.

People buy from people - I am what I am and I wear what I wear!