Ex eBay sellers

[Johnny77]

Hi ,
Due to the new changes coming in force on eBay in september, it looks like it will cut our business dead, along with thousands of others :(

Is there anyone out there who have used eBay in the past for their business, but dropped it to concentrate on their own site with good success?

I have my own site and i would love it to bring in the revenue that eBay brings us, but somehow i cant see it.


Im looking for some inspiring success stories, because at the moment im very dispondent about the whole thing, and to be honest a little worried.

Any comments will be grately recieved

Thanks

Johnny

[Planck]

Out of interest, what are these changes? I've never sold on eBay, so don't really know what they've been up to.

[Online Trader]

Waht sort of products are you selling Johnny

[Johnny77]

Hi there, we sell furniture.

The changes are basically removing sellers from standard listings, unless they have a very, very high detailed seller rating, apparantly this will effect 98% of all sellers, effectivly making them invisible to the searches.

The changes come ito effect on October 1st, right when the busy period starts for christmas :(

Although we have 100% feedback, and meet there current requirements to be a power seller, (we are a gold power seller right now), we do not meet the requirements for the new changes and we will be dropped from standard searches, effectivly destroying our business!!

[Mister B]

So although you have 100% feedback, you fall down because your DSR performance is not good enough. Right?

Mister B

[Planck]

Interesting - does anyone know what the philosophy is behind this? What are eBay trying to achieve by implementing these changes?

[Johnny77]

Exactly, everyone we sell to is over the moon with the products, hence the 100% feedback and gold power seller status, the new changes seem disproportionately unfair to sellers, it turns out we are only 0.4% off the minimum requirements for shipping costs, even though everything we ship is FREE!!

[dymodeals]

are you sure you have read this right? the way i interpreted it - sellers with the high ratings get a high position in the best match view. If someone did a price view you would appear as normal. Also if you say its only 2% going to get these high positions then you wont be too far down the list. I would target uniqueness in your titles to get the searches to your listings. Also i would 100% recommend you to get your website done and looking good. Its a must for a bonified company nowadays. 1st thing people will do it look at your site to see if you look reputable or not. also as a sales venture having the ability to buy from your site will always add that extra bit of margin.

have a look at my site. Compare it to your own. (i know mine isn't fantastic but it gets the customers in) im happy to help if you have any questions

[Chris34]

Sounds to me like Ebay want sellers such as yourself to pay for the featured/premium listings. I would start to not rely on Ebay anymore, I know 2 traders who rely on ebay and they are really struggling, a third trader does about 30% through ebay and 70% through their own website and business is booming for them.

I'd put all your time and effort into developing your website and put Ebay behind you. Only use Ebay as a tool to sell off stock that you can't shift (at a loss).



Chris.

[Beachcomber]

You are in the same position I was in earlier in the year. I made the fatal error of relying on eBay for too much share of the business and when that stream was cut off it unfortunatley hammered the business.

DSR's are the worst idea eBay have ever managed to spew up.

I used to offer free postage as a powerseller - and still got some people leaving low scores for shipping costs!

If a buyer just can;t be bothered to leave all 4 DSR ratings when leaving feedback (or just forgets to leave feedback) it counts as a negative against your overall score!!

You find yourself constantly under threat of relegation in searches and spending more and more time chasing feedback / DSR's instead of working on your business.

I suspect the trick is to get you to sign up to their new adwords style keyword advertising campaign so they can charge you for providing what used to be inclusive with the listing fee - similar to the old UK only visability / international visibility upgrade wheeze they came up with a year or so ago.

eBay has been set to self destruct for a long time which is such a shame as it is a great forum for selling - just run my blind idiot monkeys.

[Johnny77]

Thats the most frustrating part, unless you are a top seller, you CANT use the featured first option.
We already use it and it works brilliantly, now they are taking away that feature from 98% of all sellers, it really leaves us lost in the wilderness as far as the searches go

[Online Trader]

Do you have your own website Johnny, looks as though you need to get focused on this as the future does not look too rosey for you on eBay, i think the whole feedback thing is a joke and should be scrapped, how can they not allow you to leave some of the scamming buyers negative feedback is beyond me

[Johnny77]

Yeah we have a site, it works well but nowhere near as well as the traffic eBay gets.

[Beachcomber]

Yeah we have a site, it works well but nowhere near as well as the traffic eBay gets.

Maybe spend what you usually spend on listings on SEO for your site instead?

[KidsBeeHappy]

Sounds to me like Ebay want sellers such as yourself to pay for the featured/premium listings.

These are disappearing too. The option to draw attention to your listing through; Bold, Highling, Featured, Featured Plus etc are going completely, for everyone. Featured First is only available to their highest level of powersellers.

In return, ebay are giving PPC. Sellers can now compete through PPC for a limited number of positions. The ads can be shown based on either a category results basis, or a search return results basis.

I am not sure how this is going to work.

The subtitle option is still there though, and I always found that this was a very good feature for "selling". Use the title for all the keywords and product details, and then use the subtitle to give the more descriptive information that helps sell.

Personally, I think the words "local pick up only" are the kiss of death for listings. But this isn't really an issue for the commercial sellers, more the private ones.

The changes are basically putting everyone (and everylisting) other than the top top powersellers on a completely level playing field.

Will it make it any better for buyers? We'll have to wait and see.

[MH1]

I think too many people have got slightly hysterical about these changes, everyone will be judged the same way, just as they are now, and if as has been said 98% of sellers fall short then very little will change in the great scheme of things.

People will have to wait and see if these changes are the start of the end, so far every change announced by ebay over the last 3-5 years have been greeted in the same manner, and yet most sellers have continued to prosper.

It's no easier in the real world, things change all the time, the best people adapt.

[allstalls]

I would ask you to take a look at Allstalls, we have been online for one week and are working some small niggles out, but we are offering a business package that includes a Customized Shop Front, 250 product upload, a free link to your own website, plus NO COMMISION CHARGES for 11.50 per month incl vat, no it not a joke and there is no catch, we believe that business should keep any profits made, hopefully it will catch on for us and traders and make a win win for all.

[Nickdavis87]

Its annoying that they will be making further changes but this isnt going to be the end of it.

You need to look and see why you are falling short, what can you do to make the customer happy?

[Christiane]

I'm one of these sucesss stories :)I started on ebay4 years ago, and within 1 year I set up the website, now have a warehouse and staff.
I only have about 200 to 300 listings on ebay these days (I used to have between 1,000 and 1,500 at the peak). I think there's a part of me who can't leave ebay but I only list stuff I am very competitive on, that sell well or that nobody else sells. I saw a sharp drop in sales when the changes were implemented last September. I'm about to lose the Powerseller status as a result. Might not be worth having a presence at all after October.
Think about the ebay fees, can you spend the same amount on google adwords? Most of my customers come through adwords, worth every penny.

[Johnny77]

just.b, what is it you sell?

[allstalls]

Just to let you know we have just opened an online site called Allstalls, we are trying offer businesses a good alternative, we have had some nigs on the site but there about sorted now, we offer a business package for 11.50 incl vat, per month, this includes 250 product upload, customized shop front,all text and free link to your own website and we charge NO COMMISION,we believe you make it you keep it, we are trying to give ebay a run for its money and bring a fair deal to sellers and buyers plus good old fashioned customer service,

[silvermusic]

I would ask you to take a look at Allstalls, we have been online for one week and are working some small niggles out, but we are offering a business package that includes a Customized Shop Front, 250 product upload, a free link to your own website, plus NO COMMISION CHARGES for 11.50 per month incl vat, no it not a joke and there is no catch, we believe that business should keep any profits made, hopefully it will catch on for us and traders and make a win win for all.

6 posts and 5 blatant adverts, two in the same thread, give it a rest please.

[silvermusic]

I think too many people have got slightly hysterical about these changes, everyone will be judged the same way, just as they are now, and if as has been said 98% of sellers fall short then very little will change in the great scheme of things.

People will have to wait and see if these changes are the start of the end, so far every change announced by ebay over the last 3-5 years have been greeted in the same manner, and yet most sellers have continued to prosper.

It's no easier in the real world, things change all the time, the best people adapt.

For most of that I fully agree with you. However, eBay overall has changed dramatically in the last year. My main gripe at the moment is the shear number of useless 99p listings for junk that never sell. Buyers can't see the woods for the trees.

I use to think I could see eBay's bigger picture and work with it, but nowadays I've given up trying to fathom out why they do a lot of the things they do, most seem to benefit no one, either eBay, sellers or buyers.

Thank heavens they're no longer my main outlet it would drive my insane trying to make it work as a main business. It's still a great place for clearing old, discontinued or obsolete stock still, provided you don't need to make a huge margin on it. Turning junk into cash flow seems to be the best way to use eBay currently.

[Drn55]

I've answered this one already. (http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/forums/showpost.php?p=913906&postcount=12)

[Johnny77]

That is exactly the type of post i was hoping for, thanks very much, and well done.
This is exactly what i need to do with our products, move away from ebay, (and stop being held to randsom), and grow our own website with total control.

Nice to see it is possible, and is being done.

Thanks again

[MH1]

For most of that I fully agree with you. However, eBay overall has changed dramatically in the last year. My main gripe at the moment is the shear number of useless 99p listings for junk that never sell. Buyers can't see the woods for the trees.

I agree this development is a retrograde step and really feel for the sellers who are being effected, ebay.com is introducing controls on this issue and hopefully ebay.co.uk will do shortly as well, although they claim they have started, I wouldn't hold my breath.

[WarbyGK]

We used eBay when we first started trading, but have used it just once since January this year with little success. The changes coupled with the fees made it an unrealistic proposition and since concentrating on increasing web traffic, our sales are up. We may dip in and out of eBay periodically, but certainly won't consider having a shop again.

[Kailew4kids]

DSR's are an un-realistic rating as they are based on opinion.

Our P&P charges are just enough to cover the actual cost + Bubble wrap & a good quality bag, yet we often get less than 5 which is really frustrating.

I'd love to drop eBay & hopefully one day i will.

[Jon123]

as with everything box smart! A little tip, the top standard seller rating is actually based on transactions and dsr's not just dsr's.

i.e. you have 1000 transactions but only 500 dsr's you 0.5% is based on the percentage out off 1000 not 500, a slight loop hole but one ebay will close in the next 6 months.

It's a case of playing to the direction ebay want you to go. they have lost so many buyers that if they don't keep the current ones they will be in the s**t!

my biggest bug bear is I think they told all the big sellers ages ago so they could sort out there dsr's us smaller powersellers are the ones that will get stung if we don't act fast.

Regards
Jonny

[MH1]

my biggest bug bear is I think they told all the big sellers ages ago so they could sort out there dsr's us smaller powersellers are the ones that will get stung if we don't act fast.

It obviously hasn't worked then, most large powersellers have poor DSR's.

What I cannot understand though, is why do you need ebay to tell you to offer good products and service? Surely you should be able to work that one out for yourself?

The new top seller rating is based on the number/percentage of very low scores received, 1 and 2's out of five, so it shouldn't trouble too many people, unfortunately there will always be the odd client who will mark you low no matter what you do.

[Johnny77]

I was speaking to an Ebay rep on the phone yesterday, trying to get the most information as i could on the new changes, especially the stupid new DSR system.
Apparantly if you have 2 or more very low ratings, in any catagory, in a 30 day period, they will reduce your search standing!

Dosn't this leave it wide open to abuse?
Lets say one of your competitors wanted to remove you from the game, all they would have to do is purchase 2 items from you in a month, leave 1 or 2 DSR ratings and POOF! Your gone.

Also people leave 1 or 2's by mistake, out of spite, without thinking ect ect.

The new system is crackers, all it will encourage is sabotage between sellers., and lots and lots of very pissed off sellers.

[Jon123]

I was speaking to an Ebay rep on the phone yesterday, trying to get the most information as i could on the new changes, especially the stupid new DSR system.
Apparantly if you have 2 or more very low ratings, in any catagory, in a 30 day period, they will reduce your search standing!

Dosn't this leave it wide open to abuse?
Lets say one of your competitors wanted to remove you from the game, all they would have to do is purchase 2 items from you in a month, leave 1 or 2 DSR ratings and POOF! Your gone.

Also people leave 1 or 2's by mistake, out of spite, without thinking ect ect.

The new system is crackers, all it will encourage is sabotage between sellers., and lots and lots of very pissed off sellers.

Yep and ebay say they are coming up with an internal system to prevent this. Which might be true but it won't work. How hard is it to find 10 people up and down the country to buy the cheapest item off your competitor and leave 0 drs and negative!!

I would say there is going to be some big issues and everyone needs to change the way the tackle selling no ebay.

99.5% of happy customers who leave 3+dsr's is extremely difficult how many big companys have only 1 unhappy customer out off 200?

[Alonicus]

Although on a small scale, I'm probably one of those success stories.

When ebay introduced the September 08 changes, I reduced the number of listings I had from the 700 mark down to around 160-200 at any one time. With rule changes every 2 or 3 months requiring a re-do of all my listings, I didn't want to put myself through the pain of editing too many each time !

Despite a relatively constant number of listings, my sales on ebay have continued to drop, and I suspect a lot of it is down to their endless tinkering with "Best" match and some kind of variable visibility by geography (some days, every sale goes to Wales; today, it was 100% international and not a single UK sale !)

Luckily, I set up a website at the same time as starting selling on ebay. It was a slow starter, which is actually a good thing, as I reckon it took me a good 6 months to get it right !

Over a period of 2 years, the website revenue has consistently improved, both in £ terms, and as a percentage compared to ebay sales. From being a minor sales channel, it now makes 55-75% of revenue each month and (more importantly) 70-80% of my total profit. It's a lot cheaper to sell through the website. Just as importantly, I have a lot more control; instead of obeying ebay's endless rule changes, I only have to meet those obligations imposed by the law of the land and my own strong sense of ethics, honesty and fair play.

So although I'm not going to completely give up on ebay just yet (it's still useful for shifting a few top-selling and end-of-range lines), I'll be putting the bulk of my time and investment into the website.

[RJ13]

DSR restriction: If any one of a seller’s 30-day DSRs is lower than 4.4, their listings will be demoted in search results. These 4 are Item as described, Communication, Dispatch time. Postage & packaging charges. Most of the sellers are meeting this requirement and the only ones impcated seems to be small business sellers. I guess the main aim of eBay is to weed out non-performing sellers and thereby providing a good buying experience

[one2escape]

Just started my first ever business on eBay. Listing went up on Sunday night and yesterday night. I'm waiting for someone to buy! I take it I will bottom of the search results then. I only have 10 feedback before I started this weekend.

[MH1]

I take it I will bottom of the search results then.

Not the case, many new sellers seem to actively get good search results from ebay, after all, they want you to keep advertising with them. Simple truth is no-one, least of all ebay seem to know why and how the search criteria is either met or not.

I outsell many people, have better dsr's, a 100% feedback etc, and yet still come lower in the best match, go figure.

[regencychess]

We used to sell on ebay, in fact thats how our company got going in 2004. There is life beyond ebay for Etailers. These days I won't sell on there because we are only selling top quality premium products. The word eBay doesn't support that image. Also their final value fees are far too greedy.

The changes ebay have made year on year have basically ruined what was once a great selling platform. They have allowed a rougue minority to well and truely spoil it for the rest of us.

[SneakSMS]

**** **** Just used ebay calculator to figure out how much I'm likely to pay in total for the phone I'm selling... Jeez! Gonna end up costing about £40 total :eek:

I stopped selling on ebay a long time ago, seriously shocked at the final cost

[baconsdozen]

There is life,and their are other sites after ebay.Why not try ebid?.Sales just aren't going to be as high as ebay (but then the fees aren't either) but its getting bigger all the time.
If you enter items for sale they are posted to Googe as a feed so you should get a bit of extra exposure and ebid are now expanding their operations into other countries.
I joined about six years back about a couple of years after starting on ebay,now I use ebay hardly at all but concentrate on Ebid.I've no connection apart from this,with the Ebid site but I do feel it has a chance of providing fellow small business owners of an extra source of income.
Only advice I'd give is this,avoid the 'Run till sold' option which makes it look like you're desperate and when you relist alter your descriptions and title to keep your listings looking different and attract different searchers.
Best of luck.
Baconsdozen.