In Marketing? Then lets go to bed! [Archive]

19th August 2005, 15:40

Metaphorically speaking.

Customer service is something of a passion of mine. Treat your customers well and they become a life long revenue stream. To do that you need to stay in touch with them.

Example: You go out far a meal

Waiter: Did you enjoy your meal?
You: Excellent thank you.
Waiter: We hope to see you again then
You: Definitely.

And then you leave possibly never to return because life moves on and the restaurant never reminded you how good the meal was.

Plan B

Waiter: Did you enjoy your meal?
You: Excellent thank you.
Waiter: Good. May I give you our card and invite you to become a member of our food club – it is a free service that we have for special customers. You can join online or by sending a text message right now. The details are on the card.
You: I’m impressed with the food and the service, yes I will join and will be back in the future.

Now you leave having been made to feel very special and if you actually do join the club will receive extra benefits and of course the restaurant can stay in touch with you. Call me old-fashioned but I think that is a win win situation for the customer and the business. Once the restaurant has a number of customers registered. They can run surveys, offer last minute deals in quite times. They can send full colour newsletters showing the latest dishes and even recipes. They could even run competitions that offer a free meal for two to the winner plus a host of other stuff.

This thinking should apply to just about any type of business. I believe that today customer contact is vital to maintain a loyal customer base. While most in business will probably agree how many actively go this far:

1 To get a customers details at that moment when they are pleased with the service?
2 Know how to market to that customer base?

Which begs the question should the business just deal with the customer and a marketing company deal with the marketing for the business? Or in other words having developed a system that does all of the above am I better offering such a service to marketing companies or businesses?

Your advice please.

John

Rob Holmes

19th August 2005, 15:48

My gut feeling John is market direct to the end companies.

We have an email marketing system that we run for restaurants.

PM me if you're interested!

Rob

19th August 2005, 15:55

Hi Rob

Are you physically attached to the internet? That was fast! Thanks for the response I am going to refrain from commenting until hopefully I have the thoughts of a few members. And thanks for the offer but I have an email / sms / survey / promotion / competition / newsletter marketing system already. It is just knowing the best way to proceed that is my problem. :?

John

Rob Holmes

19th August 2005, 16:03

I'll tell you how I did it if you like..

My system was for restaurants, I provided them with some branded slips of paper for the customers name and email address. We than had around 3 years worth of sequential email messages that were automatically sent out once a month to the customers as they were added to the list.

We used http://www.ecust.co.uk

Collecting the email addresses was dead easy, heres how they did it..

At the end of the meal the customer was signing their credit card slip (hint they already had the pen in their hand) the waiter would ask if they had a nice meal. The customer of course answered yes and the waiter would then say well in that case would you like me to email you a recipe or two or if we have any special evenings. The customer agrees and while they are still holding the pen the waiter said well just put your name etc here and leave the rest to me....

Once every week the restaurant would put all the slips in an envelope and send them to us. We would manually add them to the follow-up email marketing system and hey presto!

We also provided additional mailouts for the restaurants when they had themed evenings etc..

It worked very well!

Anyway - theres the biz 'on a plate' if you excuse the pun!!!

Rob

19th August 2005, 16:09

Rob Holmes

19th August 2005, 16:21

Interesting - so what happened or are you still doing it? The bit that I wanted to avoid was the email address collection as it must be prone to error. Hence customer either signs up online or there and then by using their mobile.

I had a choice and decided to develop the hosting but still run ecust - but only on a self service basis.

The email addresses were prone to misspellings, drunken handwriting etc but in general they were ok.

I looked down the sms marketing route but it was too expensive for the average restaurant owner. Email is cheap.

Getting customers to signup online is difficult - of course have the facility but don't rely on them - they'll forget.

Our systems basically emailed them a one click optin link and as soon as they clicked it they got an email from the restaurant owner (Automatic and personalised) thanking them for coming and he/she hoped they enjoyed their meal etc..

Alot of people that have used it say that customers come back and they feel they have had personal contact with the restaurant once a month and they are more like friends than customers.

Hope this helps a bit.

Rob

19th August 2005, 16:36

Getting customers to signup online is difficult - of course have the facility but don't rely on them - they'll forget.

I agree which is why it's down to the business to sell the idea to the customer and they get a card with the details on how to do it (hopefully when sober they will as far a restaurant is concerned). The other place this works, and I have sold one, already is for schools (probably not so drunk so they remember to signup) so they can contact parents by sms plus all the other stuff.

To be honest my feeling at this time is that the business does the feely touchy stuff with the customer and the marketing is given to those who know how to do it. Timeing is the key and how you use the combination of surveys promotions newsletters etc to build loyalty. Something I think is best left to a marketing company I await to be told otherwise though.

directmarketingadvice

20th August 2005, 17:25

A simple way to collect names and contact info for clients is to offer them the chance to enter a free draw.

Then, as well as the main prize, you offer everyone else some sort of consolation prize that involves the client doing business with you again.

In the case of a restaurant, that might be a discount on their next visit or a free bottle of wine with their next meal.

So, as well as the list of names and contact info you're going to market to, you'll get them coming back for their prizes.

Plus, if you frame the consolation prize properly, you can create a sense of reciprocation and generate word-of-mouth about your restaurant.

Steve

daveashton

21st August 2005, 08:06

Steve has a great idea if the are clients. If not try

Method 1: Royal mail to deliver A5 flyers with a basic special offer

Method 2: Hit the local streets and let them sample food. Good fun a v cheap to do.

Method 1 was v easy, lower hit rate than method 2 but it paid for itself and our fee at 1:7 with our client basing 1/3 rd of turnover as profit.

This was done for a French restaurant in Glasgow by us.

Leo Brower

21st August 2005, 08:19

Does anybody have experience on implementing such a customer loyalty strategy in a B2B environment?

directmarketingadvice

21st August 2005, 09:42

Leo

The system John outlined is just a simple 2 step process.

As he said, the process is:

1 Get customer details
2 Market to that customer base

And he's creating value by doing it in an area where businesses rarely think to capture the contact info of their (satisfied) clients.

If your clients are other businesses then, typically, you will automatically get their contact info.

So, step one is taken care of and it's just a case of thinking up offers to make to your list.

Is your product/service reconsumptive?
What other products or services do you sell?
What products and services could you introduce?
Do other businesses have products and services that would appeal to your list?

How you go about making these offers depends on what sort of business you are and the relationship you have with your clients.

I've had clients who've done it by letter and some who've phoned up their clients.

I was working with a client on Friday who's adding a new service to her business and she's going to make an offer to her clients the next time she sees them face to face.

That suits the friendly, informal style she has with her clients and it's an offer that has to be negotiated, so a letter or an email wouldn't be as effective in this case.

I hope this helps.

Steve

21st August 2005, 14:31

A simple way to collect names and contact info for clients is to offer them the chance to enter a free draw.

Steve simple and elegant what a great idea!

Thanks for your input folks but the question really is who should I be selling this product to a business with customers or a marketing company with clients that can manage the campaigns for their clients?

My money is on marketing companies as I am not certain that most businesses grasp the marketing side of things that well. Most of the ones that I meet are of the opinion that they must advertise in the local paper to get new customers and totally forget the ones they already have. Any thoughts?

While I think about this anyone have any knowledge of franchiseing - if you see where I am going :)

Update forget the franchise thing - just did a search here and found some very good information. Not least of which is the need to demonstrate 2 years successful trading. Bit difficult with a new product.

21st August 2005, 15:24

Does anybody have experience on implementing such a customer loyalty strategy in a B2B environment?

Leo

When you think about it B2B is very close to B2C. Business A doing Business with Business B is a Business and customer realationship I think.

John

directmarketingadvice

21st August 2005, 22:31

My money is on marketing companies

My guess would be the opposite.

Unless you've got some out-of-the-box ideas for step 2 (the actual marketing), I doubt that you've got anything that would be new to most marketing businesses.

(maybe Dave Ashton and other marketers will give their opinions on this)

What you do have is something that would be new to a lot of business owners who aren't marketing experts and who would benefit from being introduced to this idea.

And I reckon it's those people you're going to have to market to.

My advice would be to go out and sell this idea direct and iron out the teething problems.

Once it's up and running for you, you'll have something you can think of passing on to others either as a system to sell or as a joint venture.

Steve

Leo Brower

22nd August 2005, 04:07

When you think about it B2B is very close to B2C. Business A doing Business with Business B is a Business and customer realationship I think.

John

Correct. However decision making process is far more complicated. This complexity calls for creative ideas that help to differentiate my marketing activities from those of my competitors.
So, step A: getting customers/prospects contact details is not such a difficult task (directories,etc.), but step B, developing the creative marketing idea is the real challenge.

22nd August 2005, 06:48

I agree. However I think it is as challenging to do the same for customers. What I have is a very simple means of delivery by text message and various other means. This is why I am wondering if the tool I have made would be better in the hands of a marketing company (they are the creative) rather than the end user, the business. Does the same applies to B2C as in get a marketing company to do it? There is a thread in here somewhere I was reading the other day where people were commenting on mistakes they had made in the past and someone said trying to do everything themselves. Could be a moral in that.

22nd August 2005, 07:24

A simple way to collect names and contact info for clients is to offer them the chance to enter a free draw.

Then, as well as the main prize, you offer everyone else some sort of consolation prize that involves the client doing business with you again.

I could not get this idea from Steve out of my mind all weekend. So a question my system has the ability to run competitions however it needs people registered first. So is it acceptable / legal to get people to register first and then when there are enough to make it worth while run the competition? And if that was what was being suggested then I apologise for being stupid already.

directmarketingadvice

22nd August 2005, 08:29

John

If you run the competition over a month, even a struggling restaurant's going to get a few hundred names.

If they don't have that, they should be doing the sort of things Dave Ashton did with the restaurant in Glasgow. And there's a few other things restaurants can do to build that initial momentum.

Also, you should ask yourself if that's the sort of restaurant you want to be working with or if you should focus on those who have clients coming through the door already.

As for the main prize, it can be more valuable than expensive.

It could be voucher for the restaurant, which would be fulfilled at cost. Or an item the restaurant can buy wholesale. Or it could be obtained from a local business using restaurant credit as barter.

The restaurant doesn't have to pay 100 pence on the pound.

I hope these ideas help.

Steve

22nd August 2005, 08:58

Steve

Thanks for the advice which I must say has spawned many more ideas this end, I am very grateful
Just one more question do you think this a solution for a business or a marketing company that could manage campaigns for a business? This is the real issue I have – who to sell to.

To a business – Be your own marketing department
To a marketing company – Manage your clients campaigns with ease

Leo Brower

22nd August 2005, 10:40

A simple way to collect names and contact info for clients is to offer them the chance to enter a free draw.

Then, as well as the main prize, you offer everyone else some sort of consolation prize that involves the client doing business with you again.

How this can be applied to B2B? Imagine you sell huge heavy machines to first-class property developers. The purchasing managers ( senior executives) wont be influenced simply through a prize (ie. a free meal, and you can't afford to spend much on them (getting them a free VIP entry to desert classic).

22nd August 2005, 11:25

Leo

We are talking two totally different markets here and this is also getting way off topic. And your quote from Steve probably won’t work in the B2B environment. I don’t think he was suggesting that is would. I do not know enough about what you do or the people that you work with so I can’t be much help apart from what I have said already.

Leo Brower

22nd August 2005, 11:35

Its a biriliant topic, John and am trying to learn from posts to find solution for my business.

We are in the office furniture industry, and to us, the only way to make a customer loyal is to build up personal relationship which takes much time and effort. I was just wondering if there is anything from previous posts that I can apply into this industry.
Sorry if I am being off topic, then ignore me.

22nd August 2005, 12:04

Aren’t we all :)

Lets back up a little here.

Is contacting existing customers as important as getting new ones?
I think we all agree it is. If you have 1000 customers and could get them to spend an extra £20 pa that would be £20.000 extra a year. I have developed an online service for SME’s that would allow a business (or so I would like to think) to:

Find out what their customers want (surveys)
Offer them what they want (promotions)
Build customer loyalty (competitions)
We achieve this by one way and two way text messaging – email and newsletters.

The original question was who should this be sold to businesses with customers or marketing companies employed by businesses?

I am no expert, bear in mind which is why I am here :)
But do the points above apply to your business. This will sound like a sales pitch but I don’t mean it to. If you have existing customers is it

1 A good idea to offer them good after care
2 Find out what they want from your business
3 Offer them what they want
4 Build customer loyalty

So let me ask you this - would you use such a service to do your own marketing or would you expect to pay a marketing company to do it for you? And we are back on track again I think ;)

directmarketingadvice

22nd August 2005, 12:43

Leo

The idea of the free draw is for step one of the process, to help capture the names.

If I understand, your focus is on creating greater loyalty in your existing clients. Right?

This puts you in step two. You've got the names and contact info and you want to use it to bring in more sales.

It seems that you already make a point of keeping in regular contact and that's probably a smart move.

I'd imagine, in your industry, it's a long time before clients re-purchase. If so, if I was working with your business, I'd be looking at what else I could offer them.

For example, you could find a company that sells PCs to businesses and recommend them to your clients for a share in the profits.

What else do offices buy? What could they buy? Which other businesses would like to make offers to your client base?

In my opinion, that's the way to leverage your customer list.

John

do you think this a solution for a business or a marketing company that could manage campaigns for a business? This is the real issue I have – who to sell to.

I'm not 100% sure I understand the question, so let me know if I've missed the point.

I think you'd have to do the marketing for the restaurant.

You'd give them step 1, a simple process to collect the contact info of the diners.

But you'd also have to be the person who crafts the emails/letters to the diners.

You can't expect the restaurant owner/manager to do that, they're just not going to do it. And, in the case of the rare exceptions, their letters will suck.

The good news is that, once you've done it a number of times, you'll have effective templates you can use. Maybe even to the point you can hand them to the restaurant owner and let him get on with it.

(which is similar to the system Rob described earlier on this thread)

That's what I meant by "ironing out the teething problems" - getting the process to the point it's a simple system they can just plug into their business with minimal time and support from you.

Then you'd have a business that you could sell, license or franchise.

But then the main thing you'd be selling wouldn't be the initial idea, it would be the lessons you'd learned from having done it yourself.

Steve

22nd August 2005, 12:58

I think you'd have to do the marketing for the restaurant.

You'd give them step 1, a simple process to collect the contact info of the diners.

But you'd also have to be the person who crafts the emails/letters to the diners.

You can't expect the restaurant owner/manager to do that, they're just not going to do it. And, in the case of the rare exceptions, their letters will suck.

Unfortunately just what I was thinking. However as you are aware this model can apply too many types of business so are we saying few business have the ability to market themselves? I fear I know the answer to this already.

The template idea made me smile as I originally built it like that where most of what happened was pre written. I then changed it thinking that a business knows it’s customers better than I do.

So as I see it

Option 1
Provide business with the tools to get customers signed up and then be a marketing company for them

Option 2
Offer my service to existing marketing companies who sell the idea and do the marketing for their clients (businesses)

And the path of least resistance is…

directmarketingadvice

22nd August 2005, 13:42

John

Option 1.... but you know that.... :wink:

Leo

A further thought is that you could start a newsletter which you would send out to your clients.

If you make it interesting and informational, it would get read (rather than one of those "we're so great, give us your money" abominations)

In each issue you could have a feature on one of your clients and the client would be so chuffed he's probably distribute it through his network (free publicity for you with credibility because these people know this guy and he obviously does business with you).

And, of course, you'd offer his people a chance to sign up free to this fascinating newsletter.

He'd be more likely to stay loyal to you because you've written all these nice things about him and his business.

You could also invite your clients to make joint venture offers in the newsletter, so that would bring in some money for you.

What do you think?

Steve

22nd August 2005, 13:49

John

Option 1.... but you know that....

Steve
Dam :wink: Whats wrong with option 2 then

Leo Brower

23rd August 2005, 05:42

Hi Steve,

Strating a newsletter is a great idea. I, however think that developing an interesting newsletter is not the easiest thing to do. The other benifit of sending out newsletter is that I can use it for new products announcement.
Thank you Steve.

John,
Why should marketing agencies buy your idea and offering it to their clients? Once they learn your idea- and find it efective- they will develop the service themselves, I imagine?

23rd August 2005, 07:47

Why should marketing agencies buy your idea and offering it to their clients? Once they learn your idea- and find it efective- they will develop the service themselves, I imagine?

Hi Leo

Fair point but they would need a team of developers and about 6 months to do it ;)

Rob Holmes

23rd August 2005, 08:11

Once they learn your idea- and find it efective- they will develop the service themselves, I imagine?

I agree with this - or they'll certainly start looking around, getting ideas and then you've lost a customer and gained a competitor.

My gut feeling is go direct to the end user, and this is what I did BUT I didn't try the other way so I can't be too conclusive!

Rob

23rd August 2005, 08:21

Hi Rob

I am not going to disagree with you because anything is possible but you will realise how much development goes into a system like this. You can’t walk into Woolworths and get it off the shelf. I don’t this kind of expertise is available to most marketing companies.
Still can’t make my mind up on this – I think I might try and find a marketing company and get their feedback unless there is someone here who runs a marketing company and would like to comment.

directmarketingadvice

23rd August 2005, 08:34

Leo

You're welcome.

John

Once all the system is worked out fully and is tried and tested, there are ways to roll it out so you won't have to personally work with restaurants one at a time.

There are already people who sell marketing systems to restuarants on the internet (and probably by mail also), so that's one option.

You could also look for people who who will promote the idea in different geographical areas.

My intuition is that these wouldn't be professional marketers (as they won't need marketing skills). They'd just need to be able to sell the system to restaurants.

Steve