Paypal Warning, Beware anyone using them

[taggingsupplies]

I have an outstanding record on Ebay 100% and Paypal verified and confrimed for several years now.

Out of the blue Paypal has limited my account, we run a website and use paypal and paypal express with 90% of orders using that method.

One buyer from Spain the same day the item was delivered to that address opened up a Paypal dispute, yes same day.

I send Paypal Scanned copy of Royal mails international receipt and also wwent onto the Spannish mails website with that tracking number saying it had been signed for in Febuary 2009.

Today for no reason they suddenly said i owed the buyer a further 1.70p after they deducted the reserved amount.

It was delivered signed for complied with all Paypal rules and Guidelines and now on our website we cant accept Paypal.

We are very honest hard working but because of one dodgy customer we get LIMITED ACCESS To Paypal until the funds of 1.70p get transferred to our bank account.

I just had to share this with fellow website owners and anyone using them this is how they treat their Loyal, Honest follow there rules customers, now we will loose a lot of sales and there is nothing we can do about it because of one Spannish customer who made a claim the day it was delivered.:|:mad:

[KidsBeeHappy]

Wait till they withold several thousand, for 6 months, without any reason :D

[Christiane]

This is why I would never use Paypal as my primary payment option. I do offer Paypal as an option, but I can pull the plug on Paypal on my website any time if they give me grief and just receive card payments.
It might be time for you to look at opening a merchant account and using protx? A lot of forum members use them.

[taggingsupplies]

Thanks for your comfort guys and gals.

I use Worldpay and Google checkout, Paypal have no reason to do this every single order within 12hours maximum the customer gets a full tracking number, i refund anyone who is unhappy.

But because of one customer i get LIMITED Access until this 170 Pennies clears and that can take 7-10 days they told me today.

It just shows you no matter who you are and what your selling and the amounts, you could be the next victim of The PayPal Ripper.

I wonder if this has happened to any of the big boys websites?

So now no PayPal for 7-10 days until the customer gets his 170p, i think its because i transfer all Funds from Paypal to my account straight away, maybe they are in a huff.

Well im in a huff now big time.

[Christiane]

Unfortunately so many people like and use Paypal for payments (no need to enter card details, etc) that it's an option you cannot ignore, I would be very angry too in your place.

They're losing the fees you'd have paid for 7 to 10 days transactions so I can't see the benefit for them really. So stupid!

I also empty my account every single day and if I can't (no internet access) I ask someone I trust to do it for me!

[AJAdi]

They held approx 1k of my money for over 5 months...thought i would never get it back

[taggingsupplies]

I will never walk alone then, Why comes they are never on Watchdog BBC1?

This guy opened the dispute in Febuary i gave Paypal everything they asked for and they Withheld the funds until Today, Then they said i owed him a further £1.70 and because i had no funds in Paypal i authorised the remainding £1.70 to the customer via my stored debit card.

I think the extra £1.70 must be to do with the exchange rate or somthing like that.

Bottom line is folks it shows on the Spannish website as delivered and the same date he opened the dispute after an angry email to me.

Unreal imagine people if you sell soething to somebody for £1000 and they say i didnt get it, Just watch what Paypal can do.

I have a great track record yet they can still do this to you.

[PromoAde]

I'm very sorry to hear what happened to you.
It's scary, I have heard so many stories like this. They always seem to end with the buyer being favoured over the seller! I use Paypal for over 90% of my payments too! Thankfully we are going over to Protx. It looks like a really cost effective option.

[taggingsupplies]

Oh just had to show you the proof i might as well i did it with The Paypal Ripper but never done any good.
I have a mortgage to pay and other bills Just shows you you cant rely on Paypal for your business and that no matter what they say in the ads,
http://usera.imagecave.com/rss/untitled.JPG

[sandforthintl]

paypalsucks.org - enough said!!!

[F1SEO]

They don't care! Even though you've provided them with good business they don't consider you as a human would - you are just a customer number. Anyone who thinks Paypal will look after them because of all the business is dreaming.

[silvermusic]

because i had no funds in Paypal i authorised the remainding £1.70 to the customer via my stored debit card.



Quick tip from a long time PayPal user, on both eBay and web sites. Always keep a few quid in your account to cover the odd refund, etc. and keep a bit more than normal in there after Xmas too. Never withdraw everything in your PayPal account.

[taggingsupplies]

Hi F1SEO Yes today i discovered im not a man im only a number i thought it was an April fools day joke on me.
SilverMusic you are very correct and that is just what i was thinking, i keep emptying it ASAP so i dont spend on eBay.

After reading these stories i guess it may get worse for me, im very thankfull i never left a lot of money in the account, and then you ask yourself? Why do i take all the money out ASAP, Well today just showed me why i was a step ahead of them.

But im not alone i have been reading this: http://www.paypalsucks.com/forums/showthread.php?fid=17&tid=33043&old_block=0

[silvermusic]

#13, It's doesn't matter if there's money in you PayPal account or not, Paypal will get it one way or the other. I never keep anymore than a day or two's payments in my account, purely to help cash flow. But Trying to avoid a refund won't work by clearing your account of money everyday, I 've seen this suggested many times, but the fact of the matter is it'll be you that end up worse off. Although it depends how much value you place on having a PayPal account, if you sell or buy on ebay it's pretty much essential nowadays.

I'm not defending PayPal, but I would say to look at all this in context with everything. Sure I'm aware of dozens of sites about how bad they are, it's the same for any large company. You also only ever hear one side of the story as well, and some are being very selective on the truth or what they say.

It's a pain when it goes titsup like this on the odd occasion, been there done that got the chargeback. But thankfully in the great scheme of things overall, it's far too small a percentage of payments to worry about, although it will vary on what you sell and the value of it. I've done well into the tens of thousands of Paypal payments over the years off and on eBay, and the total chargebacks is so small as to be not worth bothering about.

[taggingsupplies]

When i tell a story i dont miss bits out, i always speak the truth as the truth will prevail.
Please dont think i empty my account mr silvermusic to avoid chargebacks as stated before its good practice for me so i dont get tempted buying presents for myself on eBay, I do state on my Terms and conditions any items that go missing etc will be fully refunded inc postage but this is not the case , the buyer had it delivered and was threatning me in an email. We will have to wait and see but its not so much the chargeback than the LIMITED ACCOUNT I now have because of this.
The goods were delivered, filed all details to Paypal maybe not in a timely manner.
So why? On eBay 100% all verified and confirmed and great customer services full 5 star ratings on Google checkout also.
Thanks to all who have replied, Goodnight and Goodluck if you risk using them

[silvermusic]

When i tell a story i dont miss bits out, i always speak the truth as the truth will prevail.


I was talking generally, not specifically to you!

Keeping a few quid in your PayPal account makes good business sense, nothing more, as unfortunately you've found out the hard way. I did too some years back, which is why I know.


The goods were delivered, filed all details to Paypal maybe not in a timely manner.
So why?


Why not phone PayPal, at best all anyone else can do is make educated guesses as to why. For what it's worth I suspect the chargeback came orignally from the card company. Provided you've fulfilled everything you need to with regards to tracking, etc. that's about the only thing that makes sense.

Providing you have all ther correct info and have done everything asked, dispute the chargeback, nothing ventured, nothing gained, etc.

[deniser]

Ditch Paypal!

I did it one day when I got annoyed about their handling of a chargeback and have never looked back.

I'm so glad I don't have it because it makes me so angry!

In the year since we got rid of it, only 2 people asked if they could pay with it. They will enter their card details if there is no Paypal option. And you will save a vast amount of money on fees.

[websnail]

I have to admit I was drawn in on the whole "Paypalsucks" routine for a while and spent inordinate amounts of time trying to get things moved to something else until I realised that:
a) people use it
b) you lose custom and customers if you don't provide it
c) there are ways to reduce your exposure if you're careful.


C has pretty much been covered to date but I can certainly understand the "I've been limited" frustration.

My approach just adds to the suggestions already provided in these ways:

- apply a small cost per unit sold on eBay (as most of my paypal transactions come from there) to cover potential chargebacks & losses

- don't get angry about scammers, accept that a physical business has much higher losses in terms of shoplifting. It's immoral but it's part of business.. sadly

- communicate with Paypal/eBay regarding any problems as quickly as possible and nip any issues in the bud.



It's not exactly a magic, no-problems guaranteed forumla but it's worked quite well and it removes a lot of the frustration. I can't stress enough the idea of regularly removing all but a small percentage of your paypal balance so you're never exposed for more than that figure. For me I withdraw the balance - £20 (enough to cover two transactions) whenever the balance goes above £120.

[mdj101]

welcome to the world of paypal. Why not set up a proper merchant account?

[taggingsupplies]

Even though i never had funds in my account to suddenly place your account into being "Limited" with no warning is bang out of order.

Dont you just wish certain companys just went under.

I have a Proper merchant account with WorldPay but i like to give the customers a few options, since this has happened they are now using Google and Worldpay i guess if you Really Want something you will buy it by whatever means you have to pay, and considering most people have a debit card credit card etc i should be okay.

I have taken onboard all your advice and will always leave a few pounds inside the account if this ever gets resolved, Below is a copy of the email paypal sent me back.

I dont know how to Dispute a chargeback?

After reviewing your account, I see that the refund that was submitted on
the 1st April 2009, for the amount of £1.70 GBP, has not been cleared from
your bank.

When this payment method is used, it can take 7-9 working days for the
payment to clear through the bank's clearing houses, both your bank and
PayPal's bank into the buyer's account.

Once this payment is completed, the refund of the £1.70 GBP will be
instantly credited back to the buyer's PayPal account, and your limitation
will be reviewed by our Protection Services Review Department who will
contact you directly with an update.

[Idontbuy]

Why not ring Paypal if we ever have a problem with them i just ring up and TBH they have sorted the problem there and then.
I see that Amazon or introducing an option to have the checkout and 1 click checkout put onto your website that should be a good option to have as well as GC and PPP :)
IDB

[taggingsupplies]

Hers is an update from Paypal:

Without warning you may be the next victim of "The Paypal Ripper"

http://usera.imagecave.com/rss/untitled.bmp.jpg

[websnail]

Hers is an update from Paypal:

Without warning you may be the next victim of "The Paypal Ripper

Ok... Can I suggest you take a step back, a deep breath and then look at the message you've just posted up as an image.

It is a warning that there are regulations in place (from the UK government, not Paypal) that require them to confirm your identity and ensure that you are not using/abusing the system to launder cash.

That email is a direct warning which they didn't provide in the past... A few years back I got the "Your account has been suspended until we can verify you" message which was a pain in the backside. That email you quoted is a prior warning which allows you to be pro-active and avoid the issue altogether.

Right now it seems you're determined to hate Paypal for any and all reasons and whilst you might have a point re: other issues this isn't really a valid one for all the reasons given above...

Just a thought.

[silvermusic]

What type of PayPal account is it. Personal, Premier or Business and is it verified. It will tell you on the first page when you log in. If it's a personal one upgrade it and also get it verified by going through the various steps if it's not already. Once that's been done you won't have any problems like this in the future. Last year alone I put through around £30,000 via PayPal without problems, I've also had an account for many years, I hate to think how much off the top of my head I've been paid for via it.

The only reason I use it on my sites is because there's a growing demand for it, many sites have added PayPal as an option and more continue to do so every day. It's an excellent way for small and/or private sellers on eBay to spend their money.

As with any online payment method there's a risk it could be fraudulent, same with B&M shops they'll always be shoplifters, look at building a little into the price to cover these events if you're not already doing so. Not that I wish to teach anyone here how to suck eggs.

[Idontbuy]

LOL thats just a warning to say that you are reaching the reciving limit.
Click the resolution button and provide the information that they ask for.
We got a block on our account at xmas as we took over 4k in one day we had to supply where we had bought our items from and 6 sales that paypal had picked out we had to tell them what the customers had bought.
It was a couple of hours work that we could have done with out but id rather these things where in place to protect people.:D
IDB

[taggingsupplies]

Hello SilverMusic

Well i have done some research on LIMITS on accounts and strangely enough its all down to an EU Money Laudering law and Paypal set it at £1,700 anually, though this is strange as i have done a massive amount over that figure.
Though yesterday a customer attempted to do a £1800 order with us and maybe this set of the alarm bells at paypal.
My account is: A Business Account status: Verified
Its down to the sales i guess and i most likely will get a code sent to me via the post to verify more details due to my sales increase.

More can be found here:
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=685955

Thanks for all and the good news is Folks

Im still getting sales using Worldpay, though we will never know how many other customers i may possibly have lost due to this sudden attack on my account.

[silvermusic]

From memory I sorted all mine out when it got to £4000, which was many years back. On the first page on paypal, where it says "Verified" click on it and it'll take you to another screen that has 7 steps on it. In order that you have no further problems make sure there's a green tick beside each one. they are :-

Add Bank Account
- Submit Direct Debit Agreement
- Confirm bank account
Link and confirm your card
- Link your card
- Start process to confirm your card
- Enter four-digit PayPal code Check your card statement for the four-digit PayPal code
Business Information
- Supply Additional Information

[Esk247]

paypal has gone down the pan..just like ebay!

they limit/close accounts left right and centre without even checking! it's a joke...they closed my personal account for some unknown reason, no email, no reply to any messages i left them


ebay and paypal will be dead in the water in a few years if they keep this up..i'm a member of another forum and dozens are turning there back on ebay and paypal because of 'disputes' raised by purchasers just so they can get there money back and get the product for free.

[Delta-SI]

As I have said before, PayPal are scumbags.

[dingbat]

Looks like they don't have your full details and that's the problem here, from what I can tell.

The best way to communicate your concerns to Paypal is by phone. Emailing just gets you preset responses.

[derek_mcgilvray]

Yes, Paypal is a useful option for many customers, but Protx/Nochex are more flexible/friendly in the long run.

I had a similar thing about 4 years ago. After one incident of a customer on the make, my account was limited and I was stuffed until I could rearrange my payment options. Lesson learned! I never place all my eggs in one basket now, and certainly not the Paypal basket. :D

[taggingsupplies]

Hi folks

Just an update to all who responded thanks for your intake on this it was helpfull.

Today Paypal emailed me aplogised and stated my account is in full standing now.

So what caused it?

I guess my biggest order was on the 1st April when a customer tried to pay me £1800 and also the fact that about two weeks ago i tried to open a Paypal Pro account and they deposited a £1 into my account and i never got round to giving paypal the verified code.

For these 2 reasons the alarm bells went ringing loudly and that was that, i didnt need to provide extra proof etc, Still all is well now but after this i will be on Full Guard now with Paypal as a result of this the customer who tried to pay me £1800 has dissapeared as she was left feeling insecure after i told her what had happened.

Thanks folks

[silvermusic]

Glad it's all sorted now, there's normally a logical explanation to these things despite the horror stories that do the rounds.

[mdj101]

I must admit if you are taking orders like that then I'm suprised that your using Paypal. Using a merchant account you could have saved about £36 on that one transaction alone!

[KateCB]

I must be missing something - the buyer put in a dispute - about what?

If the buyer claims he did not receive the goods, but you have a proof of delivery and signature, then PayPal NOR the buyer can make you refund for something the buyer quite obviously has surely?

If the buyer is unhappy withthe goods, then he could raise a dispute, but then he would have to return the goods ayway?

We have just started to offer PayPal simply for people who dont have a credit/debt card, but I have resisted for 10 years and really don't like it; I use PROTX for 98% of all payments, so I too can pull the plug on PayPal if I need too!